Midlife Sh*t…Spouses, Retainers & Rogaine

Cathy Heller (00:00:00) - We as moms, as women we walk around with like a to do list of like I need to be productive. I need to cook healthy meals. I need to make sure my kids have conscious discipline, whatever the hell that means. Right? And then you and then you realize that this thing that we're doing, which is just sitting around and talking, is actually so important. It's so productive, it's so good for our freaking health.

Sarah Milken (00:00:28) - Halfpeeps. Welcome to the Flexible Neurotic podcast. I'm your host, Dr. Sarah Milken. Yeah, you heard that right. I'm a real PhD doctor. Long, long ago, like last fucking year, I was sitting in the midlife funk wondering, was this it for me? That day, I realized I needed to get off my ass and start my midlife remix. I dusted off my PhD, wiped the menopause sweat off my forehead, grabbed my golden shit shovel, and started digging deep to all my midlife bitches. It's not just luck, coffee, and hormones that get you through your midlife remix.

Sarah Milken (00:01:05) - It's action steps. Let's do this. Hi peeps, it's me, Dr. Sarah Milken, and this is the Flexible Neurotic podcast. I hosted my very first Instagram Live with none other than Kathy Heller, a top ranking podcast host, business and spiritual coach, and bestselling author. This episode was recorded prior to the October 7th Hamas massacre. Being two Jewish women and two Jewish moms, we would have spent the entire time crying and discussing our outrage for what is going on in this world. How is the Holocaust back again? We are heartbroken. The hostages have still not come home and are being held by Hamas. Before we get into this episode, I want to take a moment to acknowledge the terror going on around the world. It's been like six weeks since the hostages have been taken and still have not returned. We must stand up for what is right. We cannot go backwards in time. Okay, so back to the topic of this episode. We had so many of you guys tell us that you love this Instagram Live.

Sarah Milken (00:02:25) - You laughed, you cried, you giggled. So I decided to make it into a mini sode. It's light hearted and you will be laughing nonstop with us. We talked about our husbands and their quirkiness as if we don't have our own quirkiness. What it's like to have daughters when what you're not ready for, how we find so much common ground with each other, even though we are so different, and probably most importantly, why we need a good girlfriend or two in our lives. So let's get into the episode. I've never initiated a live you guys first times.

Cathy Heller (00:03:00) - Oh my God. And you're the kind of person who it's like, it's so gross that this is your first live and you look this cute like God.

Sarah Milken (00:03:09) - Well, because I wore my Star Trek shoulder shirt for you. Because you know where every time I chance get over here, every time I wear a shirt like this, my husband's like, you look like a stormtrooper. I'm like, I know, but don't. Don't you feel kind of important when you wear a stormtrooper shirt?

Cathy Heller (00:03:25) - I'm going to keep a list of the comments.

Cathy Heller (00:03:28) - My husband makes like that because anytime I'm, like, really feeling myself and, like, put something on. Why are you dressed like Scooby-Doo? Yeah.

Sarah Milken (00:03:39) - And I'm like, why are you wearing a. He comes in the bedroom last night to bed, and he's wearing a retainer, and he has the balls to start talking to me in the retainer. I'm like, this is disgusting. Like, your hair is wet from Rogaine. Fine. Then you put the retainer in, and then you get in the bed next to me and I'm like, huh, huh? And he's like, oh, you smell good. You smell like fucking redneck or whatever. And he's like, don't get near me. Your face is greasy. It's hot.

Cathy Heller (00:04:13) - It's so hot. But here's the thing. You guys are so hot. Like, my God.

Sarah Milken (00:04:18) - I love you for saying that.

Cathy Heller (00:04:20) - I'm like, so like, I crush on the two of you as a couple. You're very cute. Oh, my.

Sarah Milken (00:04:26) - God, I'm so. It's so funny because, you know, we've been together since ninth grade, so it's like, in my mind, I'm like, we're just like yesterday's news. We're like that old couple that just like everyone sees around town, like, oh, it's them again. They're having lunch together. They're eating tuna salad at the country club.

Cathy Heller (00:04:45) - Like, I just.

Sarah Milken (00:04:46) - Feel so like yesterday's news, guys.

Cathy Heller (00:04:50) - Yeah, I think that that's so cool, though, that you didn't have to go through that shitty time of, like, being in your 20s online dating or anything like that, I know. Can you imagine if you had to do that? I, I actually so I had a college boyfriend and then I was in Jerusalem for three years after college, and then I moved to LA and my husband was my next door neighbor. He was my friend for a while, so I only went on one online date ever. But it was so weird. It was a date and my husband was my friend and he actually said, do you want me to call you in case you don't like it? And who called me and I went someplace in Venice with this guy, and he.

Cathy Heller (00:05:34) - We were eating tapas, and it's the one and only time I got into a tapas restaurant and in the middle of eating with our hands, he goes, you have amazing hair. Can I touch it? And I'm like, before I'm about to say, please don't, because it's such an awkward request. He leans across the table and puts his greasy palm into my hair, and I was like, this is so weird. And then my husband called me and he's like, hey, should I pretend I fell? And I'm your friend and I need help? And I was like, oh, I have to go. My friend fell off a ladder. That's so weird. It was 940 at night. And then this is before the days of like navigation or GPS. I remember calling my husband and I was like, how do I get home? And he's like, where? Where are you? I'm like, I'm in Venice. He goes, is the ocean on your right or the left? It's on the right.

Cathy Heller (00:06:25) - He goes, all right, make a left. You're going to go to Lincoln. And he got me home. And then we started dating. So?

Sarah Milken (00:06:31) - So he was like. He was like the rebound. Second choice I love that. Not really, I don't. I told my husband that all the time because we dated for a month and ninth grade, and then I dumped him for a senior. And it's like he like pretends that never happened. But it's so did happen. And then he got into a fight because Jeremy, my husband, was the only ninth grader on the baseball team. I know, like a Jewish, amazing baseball player, like, hard to imagine. And I can say that because we're both Jewish, but it's so. It's so fucking true. Yeah. But anyway, I didn't I like, skipped a lot of this, like, dating bullshit because I had a boyfriend all through high school, so I was saved from all of this.

Cathy Heller (00:07:15) - I tell you something so funny, though.

Cathy Heller (00:07:17) - So, Larry David, I'm kind of obsessed with him. And we went to Largo and he was there and he came out and he was wearing a kind of like, baseball t shirt or something. And somebody was saying something about like, oh, you know, but we're Jews. We're not good at sports. And you know what he said? Because he's Larry David. He goes, no, I'm not with that. I know he goes, I could have been an amazing basketball player. He goes, it's my mother. She used to say, stop dribbling in the house, Larry, stop. He goes, you know what kind of center I play? You know what he said, don't you? And he goes, it's the neurotic mothers. It's the reason they run out playing baseball because they can't play baseball because it's going to hit my face. I can't play basketball because you can't handle the dribbling. I was dying on the ground.

Sarah Milken (00:08:00) - My I used to say to my son, I was like, don't swing the fucking bat in the house.

Sarah Milken (00:08:05) - You're going to hit your sister. I swear to you, Kathy, it happened.

Cathy Heller (00:08:10) - Okay, so let me tell you why I wanted to come on live with you for for this exact reason. So for anybody who's listening, some of you know me because you know you're you're yummy.

Sarah Milken (00:08:21) - Because you know Kathy Heller. Why wouldn't you know her?

Cathy Heller (00:08:26) - Of course. Why would you not know me? Right. Everybody does. The reason I'm coming on is because I realized how important this is. We as moms, as women. Then we walk around with a to do list of like, I need to be productive, I need to cook healthy meals. I need to make sure my kids are conscious, discipline, whatever the hell that means. Right? And then you and then you realize that this thing that we're doing, which is just sitting around and talking, is actually so important. It's so productive, it's so good for our freaking health. I told you this, but we've all now read articles that say the number one thing that you need that actually will keep you living longer and modeling good behavior for your kids is having 1 or 2 friends that you talked to for an hour a week.

Cathy Heller (00:09:16) - Do you know that that's like a prescription, that's.

Sarah Milken (00:09:19) - Like the Harvard, the Harvard 88 year study whole thing?

Cathy Heller (00:09:23) - Yeah.

Sarah Milken (00:09:24) - So number one predictor of happiness in life and especially later life, it's like it's Arthur Brooks, it's Peter Attia, it's get connected. Find people you like, find people. You vibe with.

Cathy Heller (00:09:39) - And I told you Jennifer Wallace was talking about like, that's the antidote to the unworthy, never enough overachieving toxicity that she said leads to kids being high risk for anxiety when the mom doesn't have an hour or two a week to just do this, that, like this literally is the best thing for your kids well-being.

Sarah Milken (00:10:01) - Oh, good. Say hi to. And Kathy, she's texting me from school.

Cathy Heller (00:10:05) - I love Marion.

Sarah Milken (00:10:05) - I know.

Cathy Heller (00:10:06) - That my whole goal as a mother right now is to have my child think the way Marion does when they're her age. I'm like, that's my job. Like, if I can get a kid with that kind of head on her, she done my job.

Sarah Milken (00:10:22) - My fucking boss. And I haven't heard from my other boss, my teen son who's at college radio silence for three days. I'm like, this morning, are you alive? Just tell me if you're alive. And he sends me a picture of him and his two, two friends next to him. And I go, is this a current photo or you're just sending me some bullshit from the other day? He's like, it's actually a current photo. I was like, okay, fine, your check, you're done for the day. And then he goes, I might come home for fall break, I need a haircut. And I was like, it's so nice chatting with you, Hadi.

Cathy Heller (00:10:59) - Oh my God, he really is so hot and you're not allowed to say it, but I can have like, so cute.

Sarah Milken (00:11:06) - But you know what? The best part about him is that he's like old soul material and I feel like. But of course, when you're.

Cathy Heller (00:11:13) - He is, he's your kid.

Cathy Heller (00:11:14) - But here's the thing that Sarah does that's a problem is because you have such an old soul, you for every one thought that somebody has, you have nine thoughts. I know I'm like Sarah. Like, stop. Like she's like, but I think about this and I think about that.

Sarah Milken (00:11:31) - Side of me.

Cathy Heller (00:11:32) - What is this like? I have a whole bunch of other neurotic sides, but I don't know how to do a I had to do a mandatory meeting, a technology meeting at school today. And the woman was actually pretty interesting who led the meeting. And she said, guys, she goes, your kids don't have this frontal lobe. Lobe turned on. So they're very impulsive and they just kind of do things. And I'm like, wait, am I like that? Because I don't even overthink any. I under think I'm like, you can come hang.

Sarah Milken (00:12:02) - Out with rumination station over here. That's why I'm the flexible neurotic, because I am fucking neurotic and mentally drained. But I like really to hold my shit together like my friend, my kids, friends.

Sarah Milken (00:12:14) - They're like your mom. So cool. They're like, wait till that fucking door closes. Like Bitch Dragon comes out. I can hold it all together. Not inside.

Cathy Heller (00:12:25) - That's not true. You're not bitchy. You just get worried or you get. You overthink things, but you're not. You have no meanness to you.

Sarah Milken (00:12:32) - Not mean, but a little bit of a dagger, as my daughter would say. If you tell me to take my vitamins one more time, throwing them all in the trash.

Cathy Heller (00:12:40) - That and I'm also like a total impulsive hot mess. But here's the cool thing having friends like Sarah. Like, honestly, I have heard that I can kind of just let it all like, put it all on the table and then have a few of the moms at school. I'm so grateful. Like we have our own. We're like, all right, we're keeping it together. Like and then we kind of know how to navigate, you know, what it is that our kids are dealing with and we can deal with it behind the scenes.

Cathy Heller (00:13:05) - But I feel like so many women are just alone, Sarah. Like, they don't have that midlife table because my grandmother used to see women every day, all day long. They would hang clothes on the clothesline together, sit on the stoop together. Then they moved out to the suburbs, and even then they would hang out. Of course, they had no rights and couldn't drive a car, but they had each other. Now we have rights or more rights, but we don't have each other the same way. We're very isolated and also feel.

Sarah Milken (00:13:32) - Like, especially in LA too, like we're all so far apart and post-Covid it's like, oh, that's a fucking. I can't go there. It's a.

Cathy Heller (00:13:40) - Project. Yeah. Yeah. So that's why I think what you do is so important. Because I feel like everyone's so alone, and they don't know how to say how lonely they feel in this season. Because when we were in our 20s, we made more time to hang out with our girlfriends.

Cathy Heller (00:13:58) - And then you make your kids the focus and you have work or responsibilities. Then you get to your 40s and you're like, I don't really see my girlfriends like. So thankfully, you know, if you have a few that you can talk to and text with and really share with, but not everyone's like, you and I were there, just super vulnerable. So I feel like that's where you really, you have such a service you're giving.

Sarah Milken (00:14:22) - Because that's why I love you. Because your TMI overshare also.

Cathy Heller (00:14:26) - Total TMI overshare. Yeah.

Sarah Milken (00:14:28) - Yeah. Our husbands are like stop. No more. My kids are like, no vagina talk at the table. You know, we have to have someone to complain about our spouses, too. We have to have someone to talk about why the fuck my son is not texting me back. And I think that there's so many issues, especially at this time right now, where it's like raising teenagers, feeling like your vagina is drying up, wondering why you're wearing your retainer, and the fact that I started using Rogaine two, I was like, okay, stop.

Cathy Heller (00:15:09) - You literally the two of you look like Ken and Barbie.

Sarah Milken (00:15:12) - The guy got no hair product, but it's like it's a lot of upkeep, you know what I'm saying? It's like I have to get my beard trimmed and, like, you know what he said to me? He goes, I just want to show you what your hair bill is in a fucking year. And I was like, actually, no, please don't show me. And I don't know if we ever talked about this, but he separated our Amazon accounts out.

Cathy Heller (00:15:35) - Oh yeah, he's hilarious.

Sarah Milken (00:15:38) - So if he can save $0.04, I can't. I know, like he can buy himself a new sports car, but then he cancels my Apple subscription because it's 999 a month and I'm like, go fuck yourself, I don't understand. Oh, like cancel my Apple subscription. Put us all on separate accounts. I'll tell you why. He says he's OCD and he doesn't like that I put things in the cart and that I don't execute, that they're just lurking.

Sarah Milken (00:16:07) - So then when he goes to buy something, he has to decide whether it's a delete or save for later. But I actually fucking think that he's monitoring my expenses so that he can be like, you spend this. And but what the hard part about it is that, like, I get blamed for all the household stuff like toilet paper and all that shit that's on my account. The dog, the dog shampoo and conditioner is expensive. That's on my account.

Cathy Heller (00:16:37) - So my husband let me let me explain. Sarah. Okay. This house is about 9600ft², and he doesn't like to deal with humans. He's very antisocial. Like, I don't want cleaning people in the house. I don't like to have cleaning people. And I'm like, this is insanity. Because, you know, I'm washing the dishes and I'm doing the laundry. I'm like, you are okay. But then the way you do it, it doesn't live. And he's like, I will not have strangers in this house. I like my privacy.

Cathy Heller (00:17:05) - I mean, even when we go to a hotel, he won't order room service. He'll go to Trader Joe's and bring them.

Sarah Milken (00:17:11) - No, no, no, that's Jeremy. I'm not allowed to drink the water in the room because it's $6. So he's like 711 and almost get killed.

Cathy Heller (00:17:20) - And he doesn't want to have to deal with someone coming to the door. So then we're squeezing a liter of orange juice into a mini fridge at the peninsula, because he won't let me buy it because you just spent $36 on a smoothie. I'm like, I can't. So he says things like, he's like, I did all. I did all your dishes today. I go, why do you call them my dishes? The kids have pancakes this morning. He goes, there, your dishes. I'm like, I don't even eat anything. I'm trying to lose weight on the and. Anyway, it's so fun. And no, he parked the car under any condition. Sarah, there's never been a time, even when I'm eight months pregnant.

Cathy Heller (00:17:58) - Because it's a principle of it. Okay, but my.

Sarah Milken (00:18:00) - Husband doesn't valet park the cars either. And he goes, I know I picked the furthest spot, and I go, yeah, you fucking did. I go, you can drop me off now in front and go find your Lurkey turkey parking space. Three miles.

Cathy Heller (00:18:13) - Is this to do it? So with everything he refuses to spend the money on anything like that. So I'm like. So he grew up very, very, very poor. But I'm like, it doesn't matter the logic. If you have the money now, he will not spend the money. He's wearing shorts that he bought in 1998. That's a billabong on them. I, I went to James Pierce and got him some stuff and he's like.

Sarah Milken (00:18:39) - Way too overpriced.

Cathy Heller (00:18:40) - For him. He will not. He's like, you will return this. I will not keep.

Sarah Milken (00:18:44) - Your credit there. Don't tell him that you don't get cash back, okay?

Cathy Heller (00:18:48) - I'm dealing with a lot.

Sarah Milken (00:18:52) - I know. I have so many husband issues like, like that, that relate to money. Like I'm not allowed to have subscriptions to magazines because.

Cathy Heller (00:19:03) - Of course.

Sarah Milken (00:19:04) - That's a waste of money. And now he has a new app that tracks if there's any memberships in the house. So he'll text like on the family text. He'll be like, who is joined to like the reading app or whatever. And because he's convinced that we all, like, add ourselves to subscriptions and we never cancel them. So he has an app that reviews everything on a monthly basis. And I'm not saying it doesn't make sense. It's just like the fact that he has enough mindshare to focus on that just boggles my mind. No.

Cathy Heller (00:19:38) - It's hilarious. It's hilarious. My husband is like he refuses to sit in the first class. He's like, I can't do it. I'll sit and coach and you should not have the kids sit there and like, can you get over yourself to get over yourself? So then he does, but then he goes, but I don't, I won't like it.

Cathy Heller (00:19:54) - I won't be happy about it. So then he does. But he complains about it the whole time. Oh my God.

Sarah Milken (00:19:59) - My husband flew to San Francisco this morning. He's coming back tonight and was like, could you wear a mask? He was like, what? I'm like, if you fucking come home and give me some weird virus, I'm going to kill you.

Cathy Heller (00:20:11) - So I feel like we've all gotten used to the fact that now it's kind of nice to be antisocial. You don't get sick and you can just not talk. I'm, by the way, this. This would surprise you. I don't stop and chat with. I don't like if I. If I see someone and I'm in the grocery store, I'll go. Oh.

Sarah Milken (00:20:30) - He ignores that. You pretend that you don't see someone.

Cathy Heller (00:20:34) - I don't like to stop in chat, I actually am. I'm like an extroverted introvert. It's very weird.

Sarah Milken (00:20:40) - So I have to be in the fucking mood. Like my husband's like, I would really not want to be your friend.

Sarah Milken (00:20:46) - I'm glad you're married to me. And you actually have to respond sometimes because he's like, if you're not in the mood, you're not in the fucking mood. Like, one of my best friends was calling me all weekend and she's like, where the fuck are you? I'm like, I'm cranky. And she's like, what? I'm like, I just don't feel like talking. But that's all I get on Instagram and like, I'll be happy. And then, you know, it's like. It's like the midlife moods I can't pinpoint. It's like me with a teenage daughter is a nightmare.

Cathy Heller (00:21:13) - It's a lot. It's like, I know.

Sarah Milken (00:21:15) - Moods do over here.

Cathy Heller (00:21:16) - She totters that are all going to be teenagers at the same time.

Sarah Milken (00:21:21) - No, no, no, no. But you're going to be institutionalized. Like, that's what I said to Kim Shapiro when I was interviewing her. She is three daughters, two. And I'm like, I have one, and it's like a full time job, but they'll be so busy borrowing each other's clothes and like, trying to negotiate like TikTok dances that they'll just keep each other busy with the.

Cathy Heller (00:21:43) - Fight badly amongst each other. There are so good people, but not with each other.

Sarah Milken (00:21:48) - Oh, I know, I have to say, in all honesty, having a son is like it's a breath of just like. It's a different kind of stress though I will tell you, it's a different one, because my stress with him is that he's like an adrenaline junkie, you know what I mean? Like, he's the kid who, like, skis off the side and like, he's no. Yeah, the kid is. He's through the trees. And then he likes skis, even though he has a cracked bone, like. So that's like a different kind of thing. I don't find that girls are typically like that. So that's why I'm like, I haven't heard from you in three days. Like, I can see your on a freeway somewhere and it's 1:00 in the morning. Where are you? But he's 19 years old. What can I do?

Cathy Heller (00:22:34) - Not much. Not not.

Sarah Milken (00:22:36) - And I want him to be like a normal, functioning human, like we all do.

Sarah Milken (00:22:40) - You know, it's.

Cathy Heller (00:22:41) - So crazy because when you're dating someone and you're you're you're not a parent. Yet you can't understand when parents are so sort of wanting to know about their kids lives to get give it a rest. But now that I'm a parent, I think about my daughter. She's only 11, but I'm like, when she starts dating. I have so much to say about this. Like, I am the I'm a nightmare. I'm already telling her, Sarah, I've already said all the wrong things. This is what I've said to her. There's nothing productive about dating until you're 26, so we're not doing it. I go, there's going to happen. So let's just put it on the it's not happening. Oh my God. And she's okay. And I'm like, yeah, we're not going to parties. And you're never driving with anyone other than me or dad. You can't get in the car. And I'm like, what's happened to me? Like, this is who I am with my kids.

Cathy Heller (00:23:32) - I'm terrible.

Sarah Milken (00:23:33) - I think now, like, I always talk about this how like raising kids now is so different because of social media, like when we went to high school, like, did you like, we didn't know about a party until like a day or two after it happened. Like, now what of parties?

Cathy Heller (00:23:48) - I was so afraid to go, I wasn't cool, I was awkward, I didn't. Parties. I know what I was.

Sarah Milken (00:23:54) - Now know where everyone is at all times. I'm like, why are your Snapchat locations on? Like, in what scenario would you ever want someone to know where you were?

Cathy Heller (00:24:04) - Oh my god, that's so creepy. By the way, I was telling my daughter today because at this technology meeting, the teacher said to the kids, fourth and fifth graders, turn to your mom and tell them if there's ever something weird, will you feel safe to tell your parents? Are you are you open and honest with your parents about stuff? And my daughter is like, yeah, mom, I always tell you something weird because you're, you know, you're really easygoing.

Cathy Heller (00:24:31) - And I was like, oh, cool. And I said to her that when I was in eighth grade, my mom said, I heard that kids are trying cigarettes, and if you want to try a cigarette, I'd rather you come to me and I'll buy you a pack of cigarettes so you could try it. And, Sarah, I never to this day have smoked a cigarette.

Sarah Milken (00:24:49) - Because what's interesting, neither of us.

Cathy Heller (00:24:52) - Because she made it. She. She made it something where I didn't have to like rebel. Yeah. And it wasn't interesting. And so I said to my daughter, I said, I hope you can always tell me stuff. And like, even when I was in, you know, I guess the first time I had sex when I was a freshman in college, and I called my mom to tell her and my mom was like, okay, how are you doing? Did you go to Planned Parenthood? Do you need birth? Like, she didn't, like, make me feel bad about it.

Cathy Heller (00:25:19) - And so then I was more smart about it, I guess. So I think that this is why, you know, we need to have these conversations and we need each other. But I do think that it's a cool thing to think about. What kind of parents do you want to be? And there's a balance, obviously, but it sounds to me like you, yes, you want to know, but you also, whatever they do tell you, there's just a lot of room for them to be themselves, right? Yeah. And that's and I feel like.

Sarah Milken (00:25:50) - That, that would be like I mean, I only have a 19 and a 17 year old, so I'm not done with the journey. But I think that that would be my number one piece of advice for people is giving your kids enough boundaries and rules so they know they're accounted for, and they know that there's like a higher power, but at the same time not feeling suffocated by you either. Like, I don't like I don't know when my kid like when Jake was in high school, like I didn't know when his tests were.

Sarah Milken (00:26:21) - I didn't ask him if he did his homework. He also I just also knew he was going to do it. It may not be. It might he might be doing it at midnight. But I knew he was going to be turning it in. So I just as much as I wanted to micromanage, I didn't. But I also have two kids that would never allow my comment. They're like. You raised us to be independent. Please don't fucking bug us. Yes. You know, that's why I'm like, I can't be mad at my son. I mean, he went to Europe for three weeks with ten friends this summer. I barely heard from him. Yeah, it's like I raised him to solve his own problems and, like, dos own shit and whatever.

Cathy Heller (00:26:58) - I love that your version of Barely Heard from Him was all the ways that you kept us all posted on every place he ate, and because he would.

Sarah Milken (00:27:06) - Send me photos but he doesn't send me. He doesn't have any con.

Sarah Milken (00:27:10) - There's no any.

Cathy Heller (00:27:11) - Clue the level of how much you know about your kids. Like you're like, I haven't heard from in three days. I'm like, He's at Penn. He went to school. He. Oh my God.

Sarah Milken (00:27:24) - No. But I'm so used to having him in the house and like, it's just that, obviously.

Cathy Heller (00:27:29) - But I'm saying you are hearing from him quite a bit. Like this kid is like, here she goes again.

Sarah Milken (00:27:34) - Like, no, I know, and it goes, she's. And the other night he he FaceTimed us during dinner and I couldn't answer because we were in a place with. No, you weren't allowed as your phone. And so I was like, fucking. I'm just going to FaceTime him. I FaceTime him and he's like standing with like ten people. There's like four girls over here and they're all dancing and screaming. And I was like, this kid answered a FaceTime to his mom and they're all screaming hi! And I was like, okay, all right, I did it.

Cathy Heller (00:28:03) - Doing something great.

Sarah Milken (00:28:05) - Oh my God, it's so hard. But I think, like you said, having friends, having women who are willing to be real, who are willing to talk about shit that is on our minds, it's not always the easiest thing to talk about marriage and libidos and feeling irrelevant and feeling invisible and feeling like you're bored as fuck and you don't know what to do, and you don't have a career, or you have a career, but it's still not enough for you. It's like we all have these itches for something new, and it's not just you. It's like it's all of us and we all have our own versions of it.

Cathy Heller (00:28:46) - It's so true.

Sarah Milken (00:28:47) - Oh, and I should share the secret on Rogaine, you guys. So I don't like Rogaine because it messes up my blow dries. So I looked up on Amazon, my other best friend, and I've looked up micro droppers. I have to show it to you tonight when we do the zoom, and it's like a needle on top of the dropper bottle.

Sarah Milken (00:29:05) - So I pour the Rogaine into there and it makes it come out in micro drops so it doesn't fuck up my blow dry.

Cathy Heller (00:29:13) - That's amazing. So by the way, I was losing my hair like three years ago, like in clumps, like crazy amounts. And that stopped because I start. And I know this doesn't all work for everybody, but I started taking biotin and oh, my, my hair's thicker than it was.

Sarah Milken (00:29:32) - Yeah. You have a lot of hair. Yeah.

Cathy Heller (00:29:34) - But it really worked out. So I don't know. That worked for me. I know you still take it. No, because this is all, like, came on back.

Sarah Milken (00:29:41) - Oh, well, wait till you're a few years older and you creep up to my age. You'll be back on that again.

Cathy Heller (00:29:47) - Speaking of hair about, I guess it's like four years ago, and it's it's literally like 1 or 2, like, I'll feel like it's like a course, like hair, like here or like here. And I'm like, look.

Cathy Heller (00:30:00) - And then here's the thing. It doesn't have a color to it, so you can't see it, but I can feel it. And then when, oh.

Sarah Milken (00:30:07) - Have you ever had a nipple hair. I have.

Cathy Heller (00:30:10) - And then I'm.

Sarah Milken (00:30:11) - Like, how has that been growing there for that long? That it's this long that I can see it now?

Cathy Heller (00:30:17) - What is it like? I feel like a chia. Yeah, body's like this. I can't handle it. And I can't handle my kids that are seven, ten and 11 that there were already having conversations about what's happening with their bot. I'm like, no, no, no, no, I'm upset about it.

Sarah Milken (00:30:35) - Oh my god, puberty still.

Cathy Heller (00:30:37) - Oh, it makes me cry. I started crying, I was upset because I don't want to think of my kids as sexual beings. I want them to be little babies. It makes me upset.

Sarah Milken (00:30:46) - Well, you're going to be welcomed into that quickly and you're going to be prepared. I'm not going to have I'm interviewing Vanessa Kroll, Ben Carson tomorrow for their book.

Sarah Milken (00:30:57) - It's awkward and like, we're getting into all of those conversations about how to talk to your kids about puberty and all of that. Yeah. And I think it comes back to that idea of like, the table. And I keep referencing this midlife table, but it's it's a table for all of us, not even just mid lifers. It's for all of us. Because tables represent nourishment. They represent connection, conversations, friendships, multi generations like we had everyone here for Rush Hashana. It was like Jeremy's parents, my parents, Jeremy's brother, cousin. Like it's just there's so few moments like that left right now.

Cathy Heller (00:31:36) - It really is so important. And I love that you're talking. Think about it and love that you're creating it.

Sarah Milken (00:31:46) - Hey, peeps, it's me again, Dr. Sarah Milken. And here we have the golden nuggets. I know that when I listen to a podcast episode, I'm like, oh yeah, I'll fucking remember everything that they said, and I never do. So this is why I come back and do a golden nugget.

Sarah Milken (00:32:02) - Summary. Golden nugget number one. Sitting around and just talking is actually more important than you think. The number one thing that you need that actually will keep you living longer and modeling good behavior for your kids is making sure you make time to talk with at least 1 or 2 good girlfriends each week. Golden nugget number two be vulnerable with your close friends. And if you can't find the time or the right people, we need to find more friends that fit that mold. When we were in our 20s, we made more time to hang out with our girlfriends. And we do right now because we have kids, work, other responsibilities. And then you get to your 40s and 50s and you're like, I don't really see my girlfriends anymore. The moral of the story is friendships come and go, and we need to find girlfriends in each stage of life, and we need to be able to be super vulnerable with them. Or what's the point, right? There's a lack of connection. Golden nugget number three the secrets to having great hair.

Sarah Milken (00:33:03) - My secret is Rogaine. So you know I don't like Rogaine because it messes up my blow dries. So I get these little micro droppers from Amazon, and it's like a little needle on top of the dropper bottle so that when I get the Rogaine into my hair, it's like not going everywhere. It's micro drops. It doesn't fuck up my blow dry. Kathy secret is she has a lot of gray hair that she highlights, and the gray hair actually kind of is a little grittier. Hold on to texture more, and her hair looks fluffier and thicker. I'm kind of jealous. Okay, you guys, the gold is dripping off these nuggets. Grab it, use it. There are a bunch of things you can do first, fucking subscribe to the podcast. I need you to subscribe. It makes the algorithm move. Second, share it with some friends who might like midlife shit. And third, write an Apple review. Writing reviews is really annoying. It's an extra step, but guess what? It really helps the podcast grow.

Sarah Milken (00:34:05) - Do you think your little review won't matter? But it does. If you went to a show and everyone said my clap doesn't matter, then there would be no clapping. You all matter, you know. I always respond and of course follow my Instagram at the flexible, neurotic duh love you talk to.