EPISODE 27: I’m Burnt the F#*k out! Are you?
Sarah Milken
Hi, good peeps. This is the next episode of the flexible neurotic podcast. I'm Dr. Sarah Milken, the flexible neurotic. Today I have a guest who is a professional mom, woman coach and burn out expert. I have admired her on Instagram. her Instagram is huge, expert and fun. She's smart, hilarious. She's on her a game. And she basically tells moms exactly what they're thinking in their own minds. She's a doctor of occupational therapy and Instagram phenomenon. an educator, entrepreneur, and online course creator with her signature program called thrive like a mother. Her name is Dr. Brooke Weinstein. Hi, Brooke. Hi. I'm so excited. You're here. If you guys could see her. She has the most beautiful curly hair you've ever seen. I actually tried to take some of your curl experts, and I forward them to my son who's 17 and he has recently embraced his curly hair. Trying to figure out like the whole difference thing. So um, yeah, pros Instagram. Yeah. So we bought some of the products the next I think, yes. We've totally gone into the Burke Weinstein hair. Love it. Love it. Love it. Episode. We're gonna dive deep with Brock and our golden shovels. I'm sure you have a couple golden shovels right, Brooke? Yes. And we're gonna dig through our layers of midlife stuff of being a mom being a woman. Brooke is going to help us learn how to quiet our inner Mean Girls listened to our minds and bodies to help prevent mom and real life burnout and create the lives we want as we jump into midlife. If you guys are interested in creating the life you want, then this episode is for you. Whether you have little kids a teenager you're an empty nester or you don't even have kids at all. Brooks approach is hands on with steps that all of us can use. Are you ready, Brooke? I'm more than ready. Yeah, my god and she's wearing a shirt that says Fuck yes. Which is absolutely hilarious. That's like when I wear my T shirt that says the vagina revolution is on. Yeah, husband was like, really? Like, I'd like to see. What is that? You're talking a lot about vaginas. Sarah, but it's not translating into real life. It's amazing. Like orgasm libido. He's like, wait, what are you practicing what you're preaching. That's amazing. We're gonna jump into Dr. Brooke Weinstein, your platform, how your message is helping women quiet their inner Mean Girls and live more satisfying lives without burnout. We want to fall in love with ourselves again, right, Brooke? Yeah, we do. Mm hmm. You're 35 ish. I'm 35 you're 35 you have two kids. You're a widow. Yeah, you were an occupational therapist. For Kids. You built a private practice your two kids of your own. And then you hit the fucking wall, right?
Brooke Weinstein
I love that. You just set my whole life story. Because usually I come on podcast and I have to explain the whole story. So yes, I did hit the fucking wall. It was I was waking up. And literally looking around and thinking, this is like, Is this it? Like? No, this is not what like. I mean, we all as little girls and men, like, first comes love, then comes marriage then comes baby. It's like, you know, you first you mate, you find a partner and you, you, you get married and then you start having babies. And you think yeah, this is this is gonna be easy. Like, it looks easy, right? Like, it's the white picket fence. And then you're like, holy shit. This is not fucking easy. It's not and wait, Oh, my gosh, and you wake up every morning and you think you're doing a million things wrong, you think you're the one that needs to change, you think you're the one that's doing it all wrong. And a lot of times, by the end of the day, you're exhausted and depleted and done, you've snapped at your kids or your partner or something. shit hit the fan, right? And then you go to bed thinking this is me. And then you wake up the next morning and think, okay, today's the day, I'm going to get through it. Today is the day, I'm going to do it without losing my shit. And so we placed so much pressure on ourselves. And it's such a perpetual cycle that it never stops. And that's when you start thinking yourself, this can't be it
Sarah Milken
like is this and you're like, wait, I'm gonna try meditation. I'm gonna drink green tea. I'm gonna take these supplements I'm going to write in a journal, but you realize that none of those things, not one thing is going to change your life or your feeling of like, this is not meaningful. Why am I here? Why am I doing it? So how did you get from burnt out selling your practice? You decide to be a stay at home, mom. Sure. And you felt like, that wasn't great either. So what happened? So
Brooke Weinstein
I sold my practice and moved here to Austin, for my late husband Jonathan's job for a job opportunity for him. And I didn't know why I was ready to sell my business at the time. All I knew is you know, I did have the peanut gallery. And everyone's saying, Brooke, are you crazy? Like he's built a very successful business like what are you doing? And at the time, I had two very, very young children. I had two preemies three years apart. I did Nick you time for both of them. I'm really difficult pregnancies. And I recognized that I wanted it to stop I like I needed it to stop. I didn't really know why. But then I moved to Austin and I had a year and a half long break of getting my kids settled and settling in the Austin and during that time, I was able to recognize I was stretched so incredibly thin and doing so much for so many that I wasn't doing one thing well enough or how I wanted and it's not the standard. It was just what I wanted to feel good about doing things I wasn't giving my all to my business. I wasn't giving my all to my children. My husband very much needed me to help take care of himself. I mean, it. We are so many things as women and quote caretakers and joy That time I was able to recognize what went right my business what went wrong in my business why, like I said, I ended up selling it as well as starting to recognize that the things and the ways in which I was parenting my very young children, they were three and four, for in almost two, when we moved on, I recognize that things weren't going well, in my own home, I wasn't showing up for my children in the way that I wanted to I was snapping because I was stretched so
Sarah Milken
thin, I was basically a childhood expert with a doctor in occupational therapy with a having had a huge practice in helping parents help their kids and you couldn't even sort of do it for your own kids, according to you.
Brooke Weinstein
Well, so basically, what I recognized during that time, is that, you know, I did the hospital system, I did home health with pediatrics, I built my own clinic, because every single time I was like this model of medical health is not working, this model is not working, I'm not helping and impacting children. This is not working like this. This is not what I learned in school, the impact that I was supposed to be making this was that it wasn't working and what I recognized, because I was able to see not only what was going on in my own home, but what was, but again, like I said, able to process why I was ready to step away from my business is, the bottom line is what I recognize is that if you're sending your child to occupational therapy, you're sending your child to me because you don't have time to handle the things that your child needs help with. And so you outsource to the experts. However, from my point of view, I did parent education in my other in my clinic, and parents were like, Hmm, what Like what? Yeah, yeah, like, okay, we'll see you next week. Like, no one, no, mom has time to take on occupational therapy homework. No one. Yeah, no, mom has time for that. And so what I recognized is, I needed to make the changes in my own home that I was requesting of other parents to make. And that is why it wasn't working. That's why once a week, 30 minutes or an hour of sensory work, or any of the things that you bring your kids to, that's why it wasn't working. And I fought tooth and nail to figure out a solution of what does work.
Sarah Milken
So you having a doctorate and you having had a private practice or practical, practical knowledge with the kids, and being a neuroscience nerd like me, what did you know about the science of what's going on in our brains? Why are we feeling so overwhelmed? And so joy less? And how did you know you could take those sort of research nuggets and make help people apply them into their real lives, because so many of us, read books, listen to podcasts, do research, but we can't make that shit, like happen in our own lives. And that's like, one of my main things with this podcast is, what are actionable things that we can do in our own lives to make change? So like, what are you seeing in the neuroscience that made you feel like, wait, I can turn this into actionable stuff for these moms and women?
Brooke Weinstein
Sure. So first of all, this could be like a 15 hour pie. Now, when I get going on this, it's like, I can't stop. But I for the sake of all of you who are listening, I'm going to try and make this as my number one goal within what I do is to make this as layman's terms, right, as understandable as possible, as well as the ability to recognize how yourself shaming and guilting yourself and ending up in burnout as a mom. So the first thing is, if you've ever heard of neuroplasticity, I know you have but for our listeners, neuroplasticity is basically your brain is malleable. Your brain is adaptable your brain can. There's so many networks and connections in your brain. And it takes about 62 days to rewire any one connection, but you're constantly having new experiences. And those connections are constantly shifting and changing. And so what I recognized is that, yeah, we can read the books, we can listen to the podcasts, we can watch them the masterclasses and the shows or all the things but to be quite honest with you, that's a one time thing that you're you're just listening to and that's not going to give you long lasting change. But what it does do is it places more pressure on you of how you should show up. So let's say you read a book, and it gives you all the best guidance of how to show up for yourself or how to show up for your kids with behavioral charts and stickers. charts and the whole rewards that oh, this is just the book of the century, right?
Sarah Milken
Yes. Your your relationship? Yeah, yeah,
Brooke Weinstein
any of that self help stuff. Okay, that's, that's great. That's phenomenal. Yes, they have a purpose. However, it's just placing more pressure on yourself, let's say you do go and invent a sticker chart in your house and in the behavioral chart, and then a few weeks in, you're like, I don't have time for this shit. Like, I don't have time and then you guilt and shame yourself, because you haven't shown up in the way that this book told you to. And so what I have built is the ability to teach mom's sensory regulation. And so what I truly believe is in the explanation that I was just saying is, Who has time to take on ot homework, you know, for their kids, we all live in such a state of fight or flight on a regular basis, our amygdala is triggered so easily by any shift in change, any shift in lack of stability or control, we as humans, thrive on structure, stability and control. And when your brain, not just your brain, but when your brain signals your body to have a physical reaction, and you have things coming up for you. And it triggers fear. And you may not even recognize it in your body, that it's your, it stops you and you go to the most comfortable thing you can possibly do to ground yourself. So let's say your kids just started school, right, we've all just gone back to school shifts hitting the fan, your kids are melting down at night, they're fighting all the things, right, it's like that is a transition, your brain is not used to the different new, new, quote, new routine. And so your brain needs time to adapt and shift. That's the same thing with all the conditioning that we have learned from childhood of possibly not feeling seen and heard and ownership of our feelings. And so what I do is I teach. I've built this model based on my children like that's where it started from. And it of course first started when I was working with kids, and then I built it and I practice it and I checked on it to see if it would work within my own home.
Sarah Milken
So premise is basically that we get to the point where we where we are so sensory overloaded, yes, that we get ourselves into this burnout cycle. We don't know where it's fucking stopping, and then we pick up the next day and do the same fucking thing over again. Yes, so that's the burnout, right? So what for sensory overload for some people who are like, Well, what does she mean by Yes, tell us what that means. Let's say for me, 45 year old mom with two teenagers like what does that look like? Sure.
Brooke Weinstein
So that's a wonderful place to start to be able to understand when you're dysregulated. And I believe that when you're dysregulated, it's showing up as fight or flight because you're trying so hard to get back down. So let's say your kids forget their lunch there. They have, you know, baseball practice in the afternoon and all their buddies come home from the day and there's pizza everywhere and, and they're all goofing off and laughing and there's dirty
Sarah Milken
reaming on girls night video games, and they're all on the basketball court is so fucking loud. And it's repetitive and I'm like, it's the bouncing gonna stop. There you go.
Brooke Weinstein
There you go. So what i a lot of times explain is like when kids are taking a bath and the lights are on and the splashing and the giggling and you've just finished cleaning up dinner and the basketball hoops like you're saying it's loud and this and that and that maybe a toy is going on in the background of the TV or my
Sarah Milken
son is taking a shower and the music is blasting so loud, I can't even think and then my daughter's yelling at him to turn the music down because she wants to study and I'm ready to go. Can everyone Shut the fuck up? I'm gonna die. Exactly. When my husband leaves to go walk the dog. Exactly. You know, the dogs already went walk that day shit, right? Yeah, he's gonna share with his phone, or he's walking the dog for the second time. And I'm like, Is anyone here? Is anyone gonna help me?
Brooke Weinstein
Yes. And that is when we snap. Right that I'm the Grenada. Yeah, and like I said earlier, what we do is we guilt and shame ourselves and think it's me. I just need to hold it together for a day. But what I'm trying to help women understand and honestly men too is that this is your regulation that system this is like your nervous system can only take so much. So at the end of the evening when you've just snapped at your children and told them all be quiet and you're dysregulated overloaded and then your husband rolls over in the dark room and says, Hey, honey, let's have some fun. Ah, you literally all you want to do is be not touched not talk to your that's the thing. It's like, we end up in the burnout cycle because we constantly shame ourselves that it's us that you're the one that's crazy. You're the one that needs to do better. However, it's your sensory system saying, Ding ding, ding, ding, ding. I am on red. I need a fucking break. Like, are you gonna take care of me now? Because I'm gonna let you know it. Yeah, you're saying
Sarah Milken
because I feel like men or I can only speak for my husband. Like he'll say to me, Sarah, I just I'm gonna go sit in can we have like a home office downstairs, I'm just gonna go sit in the office and like, vege out, I need like, 30 minutes by myself. But he can say that. But I feel like women don't have either. They just don't give themselves the permission to say like, hey, I need a half an hour.
Brooke Weinstein
Nope, we don't. And it's heartbreaking. It's soul crushing. I read DMS every single day from women who? And I have to tell you I was a people pleaser. Like I like I said, I had to take care of my husband like, I we are caregivers. That is the role in which we have been taught and destined to play. And so we have learned external validation from that caregiving role of
Sarah Milken
a really good dinner. Yeah, my husband will be
Brooke Weinstein
on love us. And they'll stay and yes, yes. And so when your husband says, I'm exhausted, I'm just gonna go lay down for 30 minutes. You think? Oh, good, good. He's taking a rest. He needs that. I love him so much.
Sarah Milken
Yeah, and it will be less of an asshole when he comes back.
Brooke Weinstein
There you go. Yeah. So we as women, we literally have been taught our conditioning, which is what I'm saying is why we're so hard on ourselves. We have been taught that this is our role, we have been taught that this is our place in this world, is to give and sacrifice for the love of others. That is what this role is. And so we don't even know how to say like, I asked my clients all the time, like, how do you feel that like what? Yeah, like, How do you feel?
Sarah Milken
I don't know,
Brooke Weinstein
like, Oh, well, he did this. And then and then I did. I'm like, No, no, no, like, how, like, I feel what, I feel sad, I feel happy, I feel frustrated, I feel angry. We don't allow ourselves as women to just simply go there and honor our feelings or even own them. And so when we do we have to get comfortable with that. We have to rewire our brain to recognize that it's okay to have feelings. It's okay to feel exhausted and depleted when your kids are all screaming at each other and the music in the shower and listen to that. Right? Like,
Sarah Milken
it's like my son didn't like the dinner. So then Postmates. And so now there's a Postmates guy at the door, but he's in the shower. So then he's calling me from his phone in the shower. Can I go get the door for the fucking food that he ordered from AAA? And I'm like, Is this like a joke? Is this happening here? And none of it is so bad or life threatening. But like you said, your whole system is like, wait all down to this five minutes of hell in this kitchen right now? Like what's happening here? And how do I stop it? And how do we get from this mode of like, nobody wants to just live life surviving? No, that's what I love about your concept. It's sort of like, let's not just survive, let's thrive. So can you tell us? Like, obviously, we can go on a vacation. And we can like, rejuvenate and refresh and take a minute from our kids and from life and jobs and all of that. But why does that not work in the long term?
Brooke Weinstein
Yeah, that's a band aid. That's absolutely a band aid. And I would say, especially for your audience, and what you discuss is like reinventing yourself. Yeah. Um, no matter what age you're at, I had to very much do that. When my husband passed away. I had to, you know, like I told you earlier, even when we were in the midst of a divorce, like I had to, I was like, okay, Brooke, it's time to go back to work. Like, let's do this. And this is what worked for me and you have to sometimes reinvent yourself or you get so lost in motherhood that you're like, Who am I like, what, what is that? Like, where am I at? And the way in which I go about it is what my specialty was with the kids that I worked with, which is sensory regulation, understanding your sensory system, and As I've been writing my book, I last week was with my editor and she was like, my boyfriend told me that he doesn't like being touched in public. Now, he said, he doesn't love me any less, but he just needs to feel grounded and public. And it wasn't anything about PDA. He just feels uncomfortable in, in, in large groups. And so what that is, is he's trying to regulate himself in an uncomfortable situation. He's trying to feel comfortable, and he doesn't want to be touched, just like at the end of the night, when you don't want to have sex with your husband. It doesn't mean they love you any less. And another one of my editors said, She's 60 years old, and she's like, I can't stand being in an elevator with perfume. And I never realized that this is my sensory system. Not that I was just crazy that I don't like strong
Sarah Milken
perfume and handle ticking clocks. There you go. You're so yeah,
Brooke Weinstein
so if I go to and you're talking about your kids, your kids with the shower and the college and the basketball, you're obviously absolutely very sensitive to
Sarah Milken
sound hairy. Like when I took the LSAT and I was like the testing place for tutoring, I would make them take the clock down off the wall and take the battery out because I couldn't handle the ticking. Yep.
Brooke Weinstein
Yep, that's your sensory system. It's not that you're crazy. So I think to themselves, oh, my God, I'm snapping at my kids or I'm, I'm all the things right? Like, I'm not doing enough for my kids, or I'm not doing this or that. And it's you matter like you as an individual, you matter. And the only way to stop that cycle from feeling lost burnout depleted and feeling like what where am I at this age? Like what am I going to do with my life now like, like you said, like you had placed yourself in seasons of your life. And now you're like, Okay, it's time for me to find me. In order to find yourself, you have to first understand how your system works, how your body works, how your brain works,
Sarah Milken
and be able to be a system, you Sorry for interrupting you. system that you call your four step approach. So I want to dive into that. But before I dive into that, I want to talk about the three things that you say that we need. In order to start the process of regulating our systems, you say that you need a body that can move and open mind that to, to your current reality changing? And then the third one was motivation to start right now. So can we go through those quickly and then dive into your four steps?
Brooke Weinstein
Yeah, I think it's just the simple idea that this this is possible for anyone, it you don't have to be a certain age, you don't have to be at a certain socio economic status. You don't have to be at a certain place with your partner, you don't have to be at a certain time of life, right?
Sarah Milken
It'd be a human.
Brooke Weinstein
That's exactly it. It's like there's no right time to start living humanly rather than as this perfect individual. You know, I'd say a lot of times, it's like the person that you are inside your home as hard and harsh realities, this may seem to some of you listeners, like the person you are inside your home, that's who you really are. Outside the person outside of that home, the one with the makeup and the hair and the outfit and the the luncheons or or the PTA meetings, or the the smiling and looking happy like that. That's a costume that's a facade. And we need to be able to show up as ourselves. In literally, every single circumstance no matter what, unapologetically. And sometimes that gets me in trouble. I said all over my social media, like I showed up for myself, I showed up for my children, and they got expelled because of it. And I don't really care like they did something wrong. But I'm not going to change who I am, or change my beliefs simply because someone else did something.
Sarah Milken
What is it not because you have high confidence? Or is that because you are doing certain tools or things to make yourself a much more sort of like a stronger anchor to yourself where you're not flying in the wind every time something comes out your sensory system like what a cool is that?
Brooke Weinstein
That's such a good question. And the answer to that is first of all, I appreciate you saying that I my confidence because anyone who's listening to this right now needs to know that that's not always the space that I lived in. For years. I was told to minimize my shine. For years I was told I was too much for years. I was told I'm the crazy one. For years, I was told to look inside myself because I was the one that was wrong. For years, years and years. years and years and years and years and years, I'm talking childhood through my marriage like yours and I finally was like, fuck this, like, I tapped into myself. And the craziest thing is by teaching my children this, this four steps and doing it on myself while doing it with them. Yes, maybe you can call it confidence that but this is who I am like, I don't know if that is confidence, but I'm never gonna apologize for simply being me. And I used to I used to shame myself for simply being me. I used to shame myself over and over and over for being too much wearing shirts that said, Fuck yes. I mean, half the shit I do all over social media. My mom like hides in a corner. Like I'm sorry, like, but like,
Sarah Milken
I know I get it because even with my kids like they embrace it now and they think it's funny, but at the beginning they were like, Wait, what? Really? What are you doing? Yeah, blowing a fan up your vagina under a dress like oh, yeah, like really? And then you know, they're over it in two seconds. But like I in terms of like being a parent and like, especially like with my daughter. I want to be the mom who shows her that you can be scared and do it anyway you can show up as yourself even if that is not the most like self all the time. Yes, but doing you is a must. is a minus piss people off along the way and that Hell yeah. But it's living with that discomfort of knowing that not everyone loves you if you're a people pleaser. Yes. Which I think a lot of us are. Oh my god, all of us are. You have to break that conditioning. Right? So to show up as you be in quote, overly confident shining person playing big is a little bit scary because you're scared the peanut gallery is gonna come after you. Who the fuck does she think she is? She's dancing all over social media. x y&z blah, blah, blah. But a certain point, it's like, you have to quiet the peanut gallery and quiet your own inner mean, girl. And how do we do that? Brock?
Brooke Weinstein
Yeah. How you do it is you you work hard. You work hard to be able to understand how to take care of yourself and internalize things in a beautiful way of my four steps of how do I feel? Right? I talked about it earlier, like most of my clients, like what do you want me to check in with me?
Sarah Milken
Step one is how do I feel? Yes. And just asking yourself like, Brooke, how do I feel today?
Brooke Weinstein
Yeah, I feel sad. I feel angry. I feel frustrated. I feel annoyed. I feel happy. I feel beautiful. I like how do you feel? Because this caretakers and women we never check in with ourselves. It's always external around us.
Sarah Milken
So if you wake up in the morning and say, Brooke, I feel like fuck today, I just want to like, stay in my bed with my coffee and watch Netflix. So what do you say to your clients who feel that way or say that.
Brooke Weinstein
So a lot of times, um, they have the capacity or the capability to actually stay in bed. It just requires them to request their needs from their partner or shift some things around. Or maybe it's not in the beginning of the day when you're getting your kids off to school, but maybe it's during the day when you're getting the laundry and the grocery shopping and the to do list and the whole thing. Like there are so many of my women that I work with that they're like, Oh, I have so much to do I this and that and that, but I'm so exhausted, I'm so depleted. One one of my clients actually in general recently, she had an entire week off her son. She just had one kiddo. Her son stayed with her parents for a week her husband was traveling, she listen to this shit, your jaw is gonna drop. He decided that that week, she was going to clean all the baseboards in her house is going to organize all the closets. And literally, like you knew that list that list of shit that
Sarah Milken
you like, I know, but let this point in my life. I think I would be eating brownies and watching Exactly. Like when people were like, watering their drawers during the pandemic. I was like, I'm not doing that. Now.
Brooke Weinstein
The point is, is that if you tap in like, you've been going and going and going for a month, and then your kid is on vacation with your parents and your husband's gone and you stare at the walls and you think should I really gotta clean the baseboards like how do you feel? Do you feel invigorated and excited and happy to clean that shit? Or do you feel exhausted and you want to lay on a couch with awesome sushi, a glass of wine, and like gluttonous Like,
Sarah Milken
I don't know why it's okay to do those things. Yeah. Yes, but not to have patience. It's the every single day taking care of yourself. What if you have a spouse? I mean, my spouse, I have to say he's a lot of things. But he's pretty cool about me saying like, Hey, I'm like leaving this house for 40 minutes, and I'll see you when I see you. But I can't say that all spouses, are there not. So how do you say to your spouse, hey, I'm not cleaning the baseboards while you're gone, and our kids gone? I'm actually doing what I want to do. And how do you do that without feeling guilty? And without feeling like the worst wife and mother ever? You
Brooke Weinstein
have to take responsibility? Did your did your spouse say, yo, while you're home alone for the week? I expect all those baseboards to be clean. I expect all those classes to be like, did your spouse tell you that? No. So I use this example a lot, I posted something, gosh, I don't know maybe two years ago at this point, where I posted something that hits so many nerves with so many of my followers. And I was so careful with my wording. and still they read it the way they wanted to read it. And it was that I would only go to the group, I used to only go to the grocery on Sundays, while my children were napping, I would rush the whole time I would run home to help my husband and I inflicted that on myself. Like he didn't say By the way, if you need to go to the grocery, the only time you can go is during nap time on Sundays, because that's the easiest for me because I can lay in my bed rest.
Sarah Milken
But we've been conditioned exactly can only do things that we think are expected of us
Brooke Weinstein
back to the external validation of a caregiver female role. Hmm. Okay. Yeah. So
Sarah Milken
your step number one is awareness, recognizing how do I feel? How do I feel today? Do I want to scream in a pillow? table? I feel like running outside. How does movement? I know exercise is a really big thing for you. How does movement fit into sort of the ideal day of of trying to reduce burnout?
Brooke Weinstein
Sure. So the first step is how do you feel and that's the first part is really the emotion behind it. The second part is, where do you feel it coming up in your body? Are your shoulders raised? Do you feel like cringing in your stomach that may feel like you want to go possibly eat when you're not even hungry? aka emotional eating? I got it. Right, like, Where are you feeling the tension in your body from that feeling? And then you ask the third thing is, what do I need? So let's say you're feeling exhausted, do you need to go to a hit class, probably not. If you're feeling exhausted, tired and sad, maybe you want to get in bed with a really, really special book, or you're feeling like you need some movement and you're just feeling achy for the day, maybe you want yoga, but if you're happy and invigorated or angry or frustrated, maybe you want to go to kickboxing or, or something like that. And so the idea of movement, children are born with the natural ability to self regulate themselves. Okay, so I'm going to say that, again, children are born with the natural ability to self regulate themselves. So the child who is scaling the bookshelves, and can't sit still and can't finish an activity and goes from task to task to task to task, that is them moving their body or can't sit at the dinner table, that is the moving their body in order for them to try and feel some type of groundedness and regulation, the one who can sit and do a puzzle for hours, or read a book for hours. They may not need that. But what we do in this society is because it's so black and white, we sit we attend the social norms of eating at a dinner table and conversing sitting at a desk during school, regurgitating information that has been given to them. It is literally your sensory system. And the ability to self regulate yourself is fucking stripped away. Based on control structure instability.
Sarah Milken
It's I know, like, ripped away first grade, I got a call from my son's first grade teacher and she was like, you know, Sarah, if I didn't know how smart Jake was and how well he was doing and all the academic areas, like I would be of concern because he is getting up every 30 minutes to go to the bathroom. Yeah. And I thought well, maybe I should ask you if perhaps he has a bladder and faction because he keeps going to the bathroom. So I say to Jake, when he gets home, I'm like, dude, like, Can we go through like, we went through like the bladder infection dateless, and he was like, No, I don't have a bladder infection. I'm bored, and I have to get up and I'm gonna do that seat. Yep. And I said, Okay, so I said to the teacher, I go, look, he's bored. He wants to die. He does. I mean, not really die. But like, right? He's sitting in his seat like, miserable, miserable. And, but he's doing very well and all of the academic subjects. So can you just be okay with the getting up to go to the restroom? He needs a suntan. Right? And so I stood up for him as his parent saying, it's okay for with me if he misses two minutes of the lesson to get up and do like a walk around. But not every teacher or every parent can allow that. No, that's the problem. That is the problem.
Brooke Weinstein
That is literally that's why my son got sick, or I got my kids expelled. The teacher wanted Charlie to sit in his tape at his little table for lunch. And Charlie didn't want to Charlie needed to move his body. And granted this is that a nature school I paid for private schooling, because I didn't want him to have to sit in a desk because I know how my son learns and what he needs regulation wise, that's what I do, right? And this teacher sat behind him and held him down. And Charlie said, Mommy, I escaped. But then he helped me back down. And I was like, Oh, yeah. Oh, okay. Let's go, like, let's go. And I was very kind and nice. But, you know, it's heartbreaking when teachers don't understand this information. And now, any teachers who are listening, I am not harping and saying not like that all teachers are like this. I am not, I want to give credit where credit is due, it is extremely hard to be a teacher. And it's, it's challenging in so many different ways. And it's not the teachers fault. It's actually that I don't believe that teachers in their educational programs, they're not taught enough of the sensory regulation.
Sarah Milken
There's too many kids in the class. And if you're trying to attend to every single is not the teachers fault. How do we, how do we take that information about knowing like me, or you knowing what our kid needs and advocating for that? How do we apply that to our adult selves? Yeah. So in on a daily basis, like, Am I saying, Sarah, how the fuck do you feel five times a day is something I just do once a day? Like, what's your
Brooke Weinstein
over and over and over? How do I feel? I feel how do I feel? How do I feel? How do I feel? Literally, you have to rewire your brain. So you have to say it over and over and over and over and over again to the point where you get comfortable enough to own it because it's so uncomfortable to put yourself above everyone else, especially women, especially caregivers. And so like I said, number one is how do I feel? Number two is where is it coming up in my body? Number three is what do I need? I feel sad, I need yoga. I feel sad. I need a nap. And then the fourth one is how do I go get it? So then I help women understand healthy communication skills, healthy communication tools to be able to request our needs from our partner, for me to be able to say hey, Jonathan, you know, I gotta go to the grocery I'm gonna go now. How about you handle the kids and me put in a podcast and go enjoy my grocery shopping and stroll around and probably dance down the aisle like, and but it's in release all the anxiety we place on ourselves while we are doing our to do list of like, oh, gosh, I gotta hurry. You got to go help them. I got to take care of this.
Sarah Milken
I got to do that. And how do we deal with the shame and guilt piece? Like how do we not feel like it's over the top or over indulgent to, you know, hop on top of your bed at four in the afternoon when your kids are yelling at each other and you're like, I just need 15 fucking minutes I have to get out of this kitchen. Like how do you not feel guilty? Like what is it? What's a tool? What's a technique that you give your clients to basically say to yourself, like, do we just memorize that like, Sarah it's okay Brooke said it's okay to do this like do you literally have to memorize or like what when do you actually feel it is okay
Brooke Weinstein
the reason that I go from this in the science approach right there is so much what's out there right now it's it's embody men and embody yourself and and i don't mindfulness and nama stay and meditation. Like I said in the beginning, who has time for that shit, like Who has time for that? However, however, if you recognize the burnout cycle, and you say, this is me, this is me. This is me and you and you start to tap in and say Nope, this isn't me, this is my body. And this is my brain. If you understand the science, you can stop guilting and shaming yourself and saying, This is actually my body is screaming at me to take care of myself, my body is requesting that I go and take a moment for me. Why do you have to feel guilty about that? Would you like a heart attack? I don't want one I want to be around for my kids.
Sarah Milken
But I also think it's interesting to think about how all of our what we need is different. Like, have you talked about in your social media, how you love to dance, I am completely uncoordinated. You like to do sort of like hit fast spinning all of that. I'm the opposite of that. I like to be in a gym with the lights low on a treadmill listening to a podcast, but not sort of, you know, fast speed, intense crazy. But that's how I regulate my nervous system, that sort of exercise in a calm, quiet approach. Where as you're like, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, yeah, but we all have different needs. And we all meet them differently.
Brooke Weinstein
But that just goes to show your son who needs to get up from the bathroom. Yeah, every hour, he may. Now that may translate into him going Boom, boom, boom, and doing different things.
Sarah Milken
And for John's Believe me see, he's, he's surfing right now,
Brooke Weinstein
it's all need different things. And I have two very different individual kids. One is my chill sitting. The other one is Go go go from task to task to task. And so that doesn't leave you, you can learn how to break that shit and tell yourself, you're the broken one, and you need to be fixed. Or you can say, you know what, I just need a lot of movement. I need to I know how to regulate myself. And this is what I need. That doesn't make me crazy. That doesn't mean that I don't care about my kids, because I need to go take care of myself. Because once I do. I mean, I had a I had a pretty rough week last week, and I did not get to go work out a lot of it. And I was feeling it. But because I was able to take care of myself today and yesterday and the day before my body is starting to slow back down off a fighter flight. And I'm starting to become more regulated and I can literally feel it. And so when that happens, when the screaming is going on from the shower, you can handle it. Because you've taken care of you you've gotten what you needed. And why do you have to feel guilty about that?
Sarah Milken
There's nothing Oh, like what is an ideal day look like in terms of if you were to write sort of like the ideal five steps to your day of having a non burnout lifestyle? Like what does that look like? I mean, you're not like, you know, having lunch and then having a massage and then someone else goes to the market for you like what does it look like in a real life?
Brooke Weinstein
You know, I actually don't think there are five steps. I actually think there's just simply one it's what are your shoulds? And what are your musts if it's if it's a fuck Yes, go do it. If you don't want to have ladies lunch, and that sounds exhausting, but you probably should do it because you got to keep up with them. And they're your girlfriend's and did the job. But you don't really want to listen to Sally's hair products anymore. And whatever it it like, say no. Like, go do what feels good for you. That is how you become a conscious parent. Because you're enjoying every single experience and being present in every single moment because you've chosen them. Do
Sarah Milken
you think that's something that we earned by the time we get to midlife because we can't teach our 14 year olds to say fuck the system. But we can say you can have strong opinions and you don't have to follow the crowd all the time. But you some shit, you just have to do. But I feel like by mid life, you've earned the right to say no, no, yes, yes. But as teenagers you sort of have to go with the program a little bit.
Brooke Weinstein
That's a really hard one for me, because what I do, I'm trying to push the envelope of saying that's just societal norms. Like why do we have to fit in a box it all the all the childhood wounds and all the conditioning that we are trying to break now as women like it perpetuates from our childhood. And honestly, sometimes when I'm looking at my kiddos and I'm saying dude, like you got to come on, like you got to do this or that now that we're somewhat going back out into the world. It infuriates me It frustrates me that much more because I want my children to know if I'm building within their home. It's okay for you to be exactly who you are. Even if there's difficult moments or even if whatever it is like I still love you, it's okay to be who you are. Why am I telling them outside the walls of my home, that they need to be someone different that's confusing. And so yeah, I looked at my kids and I was like, Mommy got you expelled? I was like, because your teacher was like that. Like I tell my kids, I tell them how it is. I think we shy away from telling our children exactly how it is. And being blunt and honest with
Sarah Milken
me my husband's as I'm like, the queen of TMI. And I'm like, You know what? I feel like if we share I mean, you I think there's a line. Because if you overshare you don't want your kids to think they're responsible for your mental health.
Brooke Weinstein
There's a way right. How do I communicate? There's a way that I feel sad. It's not you punched me so and you made me feel that way. Exactly. Sad. today. I I taking responsibility?
Sarah Milken
Yeah. No, in terms of sacrifice. Sacrifice is like a big thing. My mom, my kids are always like, you always act like such a martyr like that thought that I'm like, Oh my god, that word, that word is coming to haunt me because I used to use that word with my mother to do we need to sacrifice our well being for our kids and our spouses? No. The answer is no. And how do you how do you rewire your brain to not do that?
Brooke Weinstein
It's, it's painful, it's uncomfortable. But it feels so good that you want to keep doing it after you finally do it.
Sarah Milken
So it's like a muscle that you build. And it's like, at the beginning, it's hard and an egg's. And you're like, you're not sure if this workout is going to work out. But then you sort of become addicted to the feeling of being on your own.
Brooke Weinstein
Well, what I will say is the fear the discomfort that you're feeling within your body, that's literally your brain rewiring, that's your brain saying what this feels uncomfortable. Stop that I don't want to do that. This is new that What are you talking about? And you can look at that, internally look at your brain and be like, no, like, yeah, brain? Yeah, this is new. Yep, this is different.
Sarah Milken
It's such an important thing, because I think that in any kind of personal growth journey, and like for this podcast, it's like midlife self reinvention pod a journey, it's like, there has to be some level of discomfort for growth. It's like a fact. And if it was easy, then everybody would do it. And we would all sort of stay in the same place. But as long as we can continue to sort of push our own boundaries and step outside of our own comfort zones, we are going to continue to grow. I will
Brooke Weinstein
read you my absolute favorite quote, yes, do that. when life gets scary and difficult, we tend to look for solutions in places where it's easy, or at least familiar to do so. And not in the dark, uncomfortable places where real solutions might lie. You have to step out outside of your comfort zone. You have to it's uncomfortable, you feel displaced, you feel out of control you feel but let's let's take it home with Bernie Brown, like you want to live in the arena or you want to sit in a seat and watch the you know, the circus go by like what do I always choose the arena? Yeah, and that's what I want out of people in my life who are living in the arena who are going there and trusting themselves enough to to do it.
Sarah Milken
And the arena is hard. It's not easy. It's like you're running naked, you're uncomfortable you're experiencing now Yeah, you are exposed,
Brooke Weinstein
it's really that's a problem is we are feeling exposed when you're living in the arena, because not enough of us are not enough of us are. And in order for our children, to find the right partners long term and to find the love that they want or to find the connection within friendships and, and and careers and to help our next generation, like we have to stand out we have to do this for our children. We owe it to them.
Sarah Milken
At the end of the day, you say that most women are wanting to feel seen and heard right now. So in wanting to create meaningful lives what is the single thing that women can do from your approach to make that happen?
Brooke Weinstein
You can feel seen and heard by yourself that's it. It's not the external validation anymore of like, if I just do this, they will tell me I'm enough. It's I feel what what do I need? I'm gonna go get it. allowing yourself to feel seen and heard by yourself
Sarah Milken
and saying I feel selfish.
Brooke Weinstein
Exactly saying it's enough. It's just enough to just feel seen and heard by myself and I matter I have residency on this earth. And I matter my feelings matter and what I need matters.
Sarah Milken
How do we know showing up for ourselves is gonna bring that enoughness to take that risk to take those steps?
Brooke Weinstein
Is what you're doing right now working for you. I'd say that I'd asked that person that like, I can't guarantee you that, but is what you're doing right now working? And if it's not, then
Sarah Milken
what do you have to lose? Of all of your clients who are going through this sort of D burnout process with you and your thriving sort of program, how to thrive? What is the theme for the women who are coming out of it? And like, what are they saying?
Brooke Weinstein
They don't want to stop working with me. No, literally, like I. And I'm saying that because I just finished it. Um, I just finished program and they're like, then we can't like, what
Sarah Milken
is it because they're being seen by you?
Brooke Weinstein
Because they're learning how to be seen by themselves. I'm just, I'm just just the boat from from island A to B. I'm not doing this for them. But
Sarah Milken
what tools are you giving them like, give me like a real world example real life tool that a woman in your group is using to make meaningful life for themselves? I just allow them to be open and honest. And if the lights are blasting, the music's blasting, you're giving your kids a bath, or your teenagers screaming in the shower, you go through the four steps, right? But are you worried early as in? Well, what are the literal steps?
Brooke Weinstein
You say? I feel overwhelmed. I feel like I'm tethered to my body. Right? How where do you feel in your body? What do you need, I need a break. So you tag your partner in, or you, you put your plugs in, like you're saying and step outside the room, but still be able to see your kids so they don't, you know, put themselves in the bathtub, like you're able to figure out what it is that you need by honoring where you're at, and and even questioning where you're at, or owning how you're feeling. But you have to take awareness because the first step like we just go, we just snap, we just jump into action. But if we can stop that split second of saying Hold on, let me let me check in with me. Is it my kids? Or is it me? Is it my kids? Or is it my body? If you can check in with yourself in that split second of taking care of you to be seen and heard. We're not perpetually projecting it onto our kids. And making them feel like they've done something wrong.
Sarah Milken
Do you think like we were talking before we started recording about like empty nest like with me, I have my son leaves in two years my daughter leaves him for. And a lot of people talk about empty nest because it's really hard in the sense that if you've been primarily a mother, and then you're sort of project children, if you laugh, for lack of a better term go off to college, who am I? What's left for me? Do you feel that women who are going through your program or asking themselves these sort of self reinvention questions along the way are going to have an easier time once they get to that emptiness point because they've asked those questions of like, how do I feel? What do I need? And maybe they started earlier rather than the week after their kids left?
Brooke Weinstein
Yes. Because you're taking ownership of your life by by giving yourself space to feel your feelings if if you put everyone first for 18 years, when they when the door shuts, you're gonna say all right now what the hell do I do, right? But if all along the way, you're checking in and taking care of yourself, you'll still be able to do the same thing. Okay, I feel sad, my kids are gone. What do I do now? Like, you'll know you'll or I feel sad. My kids are gonna leave in a year. How do I feel? What do I do? Like, you'll be taking care of your emotions and sensory and regulation system at every single moment of your life.
Sarah Milken
I love that. Before we wrap up, I want to ask you, is there one thing that you want women and women in midlife to know about self reinvention and reducing burnout and the second half of life and what would that be?
Brooke Weinstein
It's that it's possible. Like literally that's it like it's possible. It's it's not a fleeting thought. It's possible, but you have to want it and you have to say, I got to figure this out. You have to decide that you're worthy enough that you saw Other women are wanting the work with me so bad, but they can't even feel worthy enough to pay for it or feel like they're worthy enough to give this or I say gift, gift this to themselves. Because we've put so many people above ourselves. We're literally so many years and the more years you do it, the more conditioning your brain is going to get, and the harder it is to break. And so the biggest thing is that it is possible, it is doable. I've reinvented myself many, many times and I'm still you know, like, you're not the same person. Tomorrow's your today. And it is possible.
Sarah Milken
So is the first step. Acknowledging that you're enough.
Brooke Weinstein
Yes, acknowledging that. You're worthy. That's really the step is like, I don't push women into working with me if they want this that they need to decide because that's literally the first step for them is like, damn it. I am worth it. I'm gonna do this. Yeah, it's a huge empowerment step for them. Huge.
Sarah Milken
Yeah, I feel like the midlife reinvention journey touches on so many of these things of being scared not feeling and feeling small, being a beginner learning new things as you go. It's like so many things in so many iterations. And it's also this notion of being comfortable in the uncomfortable. Oh, my bestie because we're not going to be comfortable a lot of the time in a growth stage. It's gonna feel lumpy and bumpy. Now, if listeners want to find your book, where can they find you? I would say I apologize. My dog is going to bounce. Okay.
Unknown Speaker
That's okay. Hold on.
Brooke Weinstein
I would say the best place to find me is Instagram or my website, Instagram. My name is Brock with an E. And then half of my last name w e i n s t. Okay. Yeah. And my website is Brooke Weinstein dotnet.
Sarah Milken
Okay, so Brooke, I want to thank you for helping us understand what burnout and sensory overload mean, and some of the key steps and breaking the burnout cycle so that we can create more meaningful lives. I want everyone to think about what should they can start doing today that one small step of being enough. I want to thank Brooke for highlighting the tools and inspiration that help us to continue to recreate ourselves in the pre midlife midlife and beyond. And hence this podcast, Dr. Brooke Weinstein. Thank you. Thank you for having me. I really appreciate you so much. And I hope you have a great day. I'm taking a picture of you love it. All right. Well, thank you so much. Talk to you soon. So sorry. Oh, no go That was
Brooke Weinstein
so good. I really enjoy. I always love that. This is why I do once a month podcast because I just I love them.
Sarah Milken
I love talking to you. Good. Well, let's keep connecting Yes. Okay.