Reinvent Me in Midlife: Rediscovering Passion and Purpose After 40

CAMILLA 00:00:00  Look at my my life like I did at turning 50. I thought my favorite was my 40s because I took care of my mental health, and mental health was my number one priority. I can feel emotional saying this because for so many years I didn't and he came last.

SARAH  00:00:20  Hey peeps, welcome to the Flexible Neurotic Podcast. I'm your host, doctor Sarah Milken. Yeah, you heard that right. I'm a real PhD doctor. Long, long ago, like last fucking year, I was sitting in the midlife funk wondering, was this it for me? That day, I realized I needed to get off my ass and start my midlife remix. I dusted off my PhD, wipe the menopause sweat off my forehead, grabbed my golden shit shovel, and started digging deep to all my midlife bitches. It's not just luck, coffee and hormones that get you through your midlife remix. It's action steps. Let's do this. Welcome back to the Flexible Neurotic Podcast. I'm doctor Sarah Millican. This is the Midlife Self Reinvention podcast, where we talk about all the Uggs and fabulous cities of midlife.

SARAH  00:01:15  Today I have an amazing guest who drove up from Palm Desert today. She's basically a pickle pickleball champion at this point, but that's just her side gig for her real life. She's a life coach. She's a hypnotist. She is a meditation expert. She's the best selling author of three books. I'm going to show them to you today, and I am so excited to have her here. Her name is Camilla Sager. Dollar up. Did I say that right? Perfect, perfect. And she's wearing amazing yellow which is my favorite. We're kind of in like a color combo. So I'm wearing the yellow shoes yellow shirt I love it.

CAMILLA 00:01:55  I'm going out in those later. You just don't know it yet.

SARAH  00:02:00  Oh my God, but I didn't. I have to be honest, I didn't wear them here because the escalator up here, I was like, I'm going to be the person whose heel is stuck in the escalator. I've done that. Yeah. And the escalator here is broken. I'm already profusely fucking sweating, so.

SARAH  00:02:13  But we're not going to talk about that. We're just going to. Yeah, we're going to sell through. Exactly. today we're going to talk about my favorite topic, midlife self reinvention. I know that you're like the queen of that. Not only do you teach it to your clients, but you did it yourself. So tell us, like the quick snapshot of your. I mean, first of all, I forgot to mention Dancing With the Stars UK champion. All the things like what the fuck? Honestly, I couldn't even do like school PE, dance like the like. The dance routines were too long. I couldn't memorize them. Like, how did you get there and why did you stop? And where are you now?

CAMILLA 00:02:54  Yeah, I think that my story is just one of these, many, many, many reinvention stories that most of us really go through in life. But mine was, started at six years old, I guess, with with my first passion was dancing. And I just got obsessed with dancing, and it became my career and took me all the way through to Dancing with the stars.

CAMILLA 00:03:14  So Strictly Come Dancing in the U.S., it's called champion and I saw the world with this, hobby, sport, career passion of mine, which was ballroom and Latin dancing and it was incredible. But the scary part for me really started, in my mid 30s, when I suddenly one day woke up and thought, this thing that I've been obsessed with, it's been my life, it's my identity. Like, I literally don't know who I am is like Camila, the dancer. That was my name. I know you said my full name a minute ago, but I used to be Camilla the dancer. Like, people would just go, oh, that's my friend Camilla the dancer. Yeah.

SARAH  00:03:50  The harp. Like, yeah, the her blonde dancer. The weirdest thing.

CAMILLA 00:03:54  It was like. And I remember suddenly starting to think. But I'm also a person. Like, when did this thing become like my life, who I am? And that was the scary thing because I felt completely out of love with it.

CAMILLA 00:04:06  And I know that many people will probably listen and think, oh gosh, I know that feeling. Something that I really cared about and that could be a relationship, or it can be your career, right? And suddenly you just think, I'm not in love with this. And for many, many years, I for three years, anyway, I prayed that I will fall back in love with this thing that I was now an expert at.

SARAH  00:04:26  So you were doing it towards the end, but not loving.

CAMILLA 00:04:28  It, not loving.

SARAH  00:04:29  It. And it wasn't like you had this major injury and you couldn't do it. It was just a psychological thing. That's so interesting.

CAMILLA 00:04:36  Yeah, I was heading for a burnout. I didn't know that at the time, but because I'd never really, I never stopped. It was always another competition, another gig then, you know, was like being really successful at the top of your game. Then Strictly Come Dancing came along. So I was just on this treadmill and I never really had time to stop and think, who am I? And do I want this? And that's that was the whole idea of why I ended up writing my second book, Reinvent Me, because it was really scary to stop and think right here.

CAMILLA 00:05:05  And at the time I thought, you know, gosh, this is something that I might need again when, you know, I might have another reinvention or menopause or whatever it is, you know what I mean? And I thought this could be helpful for me to share the tools that I used, and I may need them myself again, and then for other people to have that at hand for all these times that we we want to reinvent in life, because it's okay to reinvent. I actually thought at the time that my like being ungrateful because I have this great career and people love to remind me that you're so lucky, you have the best job. And I'm thinking, I know, and I'm grateful for all of the experiences, but I'm no longer in love with this. I have no more to share here. No more.

SARAH  00:05:42  To give. Well, it's important that you actually stopped and recognize the kind of like, now what? Yeah, because we can't do the same thing forever. We always have to do kind of a reiteration.

SARAH  00:05:53  I mean, Arthur Brooks talks about that a lot in his work and just that you can't be one thing forever. And the beauty in life, which is hard and good is the evolution into the next thing, right? Kind of the crystallized versus like fluid intelligence thing. Right? So where I think a lot of people watching, including myself, it's like, where do you start and how did you what was like the first thing you did to figure out, like, who am I outside of being this dancer?

CAMILLA 00:06:23  So I used a lot of mind tools to win. To be successful. I'd work with some really fantastic people sports psychologist, energy workers, life coaches, hypnotherapist myself. You're like the Woowoo queen. I was already, but but I'd used the tools to to be successful. And it was sort of, although it had been an inward journey, hadn't been the inward journey to what does it feel like to just be content, just waking up and being Camilla and not because I'm on TV or I'm doing this job or I'm wearing a.

SARAH  00:06:55  Fabulous hot outfit.

CAMILLA 00:06:57  Right? Exactly. Yeah. So it was scary because I guess I was ready to sort of start at the bottom. It was just signing up for a course, you know, new linguistic programming. I studied mindfulness. Anything to do with crystals, aromatherapy. I covered it like I just dived in and one course at a time, I just, started to understand how I could use all of these tools to really feel good inside out and without any of the outside stuff, without the career in that way. And I thought, I want to share this in my, in my books. And, and I want to help other people who are going through challenging times.

SARAH  00:07:37  So looking back on it, on your experience and like what you have your clients do now, I mean, obviously there are so many modalities, mind body connection, so many things like what's in your toolbox, like what are your go to favorites for yourself and for your clients?

CAMILLA 00:07:57  I think my, my biggest passion really is the subconscious mind, because it runs our lives 95% of the time.

CAMILLA 00:08:05  And I realized in my sport, I was not the best, most natural dancer if there is such a thing. Because for me, it was plain hard work was what got me there.

SARAH  00:08:14  For 10,000 hours.

CAMILLA 00:08:15  That's what got me that right. But it was also really understanding the power of my mind and my mindset, and how the subconscious mind could get in my way on game day if I hadn't prepared right? So I'm obsessed with aligning on a subconscious level, and I think we know so much within when we dare to be quiet enough to listen. I really believe that the dancing has helped me in the mind body connection, because I truly believe, like I work a lot with the chakras, the energy fields in the body. I think our bodies constantly are giving us messages through these energy fields again if we get quiet enough to listen.

SARAH  00:08:56  So with the chakras, some people are probably like, what? What is she talking about? Kind of. I mean, obviously that could be a whole series onto itself, but like give us sort of the itty bitty yeah version of that and how we could get into that, because I know you do some online courses and yes.

CAMILLA 00:09:13  Since we spoke last, actually I launched my own app send me.

SARAH  00:09:17  Right. Does that me okay. Yeah. Perfect.

CAMILLA 00:09:18  And, and so all of these, courses are on there. And the chakra balancing really we have seven main chakras in the body. Those are the seven main energy fields running from the top of the head and all the way down to the root chakra at the bottom of the spine. Chakra means wheel of energy. I mean, we have many wheels of energy in the body, but when we think about all of these areas, the one that I like to think about sort of, first is the throat chakra, because somebody the other day called me and said, come on, I'm coming down with a cold. I've been working really hard. I feel out of balance. And I mean, that's the throat chakra right there. The words out of balance. This is where we tune in. We understand. Am I in or out of balance? Am I doing more than I'm resting? So we get these little signs in.

CAMILLA 00:10:00  Usually starts with a tickle in the throat. Right? We're like, yeah, I think some I'm coming down with something That's the first sign. And I like, just say, that.

SARAH  00:10:08  Was me this week, right? We can reverse a cold.

CAMILLA 00:10:11  I believe if we listen, if you literally go, okay, I need to take care for myself. I need, like, tonight to bed early, hot bath, sauna, whatever it is. And so I love using tools like that. If I feel a tickle, I'm like, oh, infrared sauna. You know, I'm gonna just early night herbal tea, you know, all of those things. So I think another one that people talk a lot about anxiety. Right? Right, are heart chakra. Sometimes when things are really weighing on us, we will say things. This conversation, this situation in my life is weighing on me and we're pointing towards our chest. What is it that's weighing on us? What is it that we want to release? Sometimes if we release it in a meditation or in a journaling can be really helpful to soften that angst.

CAMILLA 00:10:57  emotions. We feel like in our bellies. We know this. You know your mother. You know that children often feel like mom, I feel nervous. I have butterflies in my belly. We go straight to that emotional center. Yet as adults, we stopped sometimes talk about, well, what? What is it that if we say, I feel stuck, that's that's our bellies right here. So when I was stuck in the, you know, in the career, I started feeling like tight in this area. I was like, things aren't flowing. I'm not I don't feel creative. I have nothing to give. I feel empty, pointing towards our bellies like our bodies are speaking to us.

SARAH  00:11:29  And you also referred to this sort of as like the three brains, right? Yes, I love that. Yeah. Tell us about that. So we have.

CAMILLA 00:11:36  Three brains and we have the logical brain that we all like to hang out.

SARAH  00:11:39  I mean, that's rumination station for me. Like that's my favorite fucking place.

SARAH  00:11:43  I mean, it's not really my favorite, but that's where you go. I go, yeah.

CAMILLA 00:11:47  So a lot of my clients do that. And so what I found through the years of coaching was that sometimes when they're like, I can't work this out, Camila, and they're super smart like yourself, like super smart, clever. And I'm like, can you just drop into your heart? Like, just feel like, just put your hand on your heart and ask, how do I feel about this? How do I feel about this? That's the feeling brain. And they go, do you know what? I feel like I'm done with this. I want to move on. And I'm like, are you listening to what you're saying? A minute ago you said, you don't know. You do know, but you don't want to. You don't really want to maybe acknowledge that. Like, I didn't want to acknowledge that I was done right, but I felt it. Same with the belly, the gut feeling.

CAMILLA 00:12:26  When we have that gut feeling, how annoying is it when we kind of excited about doing something? And then we get that gut feeling like, you know, this isn't really for you. And we're like, oh, well, I'll try it out anyway.

SARAH  00:12:37  Yeah, it's like, I shouldn't have said yes to this. I shouldn't have let my kid go to that. And then something weird happens and then you're like, fuck, why did I do? I know it's like our gut. And I think a lot of times moms are good at listening to them, and sometimes we ignore them and then we just kick ourselves for doing the ignore because like, women know shit, we know. We just know. The sixth sense is that. Yeah. And especially as a mom, it's like, you know, when something's not in balance.

CAMILLA 00:13:06  So when did we learn to not trust that? Right. When did we learn that? No. Go to the logical mind because it's better you go do that, you go do that.

CAMILLA 00:13:14  But if it's not for us, the body is telling us. So I.

SARAH  00:13:18  Love that. I just think, I think part of it is that we're in this world that's so performance driven. It's like, you know, it's like, did you get this degree? Did you do your 10,000 steps? Did you check this box? Doo doo dah dah dah dah dah dah. That sometimes we kind of, like, get stuck in the kind of metric game.

CAMILLA 00:13:38  Yeah. And the doing.

SARAH  00:13:40  Doing I mean, how much can you do. And then feeling guilty for taking a break I agree. Like can I be productive while I'm sitting on my ass?

CAMILLA 00:13:49  That was me. Yeah, I honestly to be honest, that was I had never had a to and this sounds honestly crazy. As I say it, I'd never had a two week holiday until my honeymoon. Wow. And my husband was like, babe, I really want you to be present. I mean, this is so funny to me now because obviously now I teach this.

CAMILLA 00:14:09  Yeah. He said, is there a maybe could you put your BlackBerry? That's what I have back then in the safe and just like take it out like one.

SARAH  00:14:16  No, it's my arm.

CAMILLA 00:14:17  And I was like, I realized I was a workaholic. I was just working all ways. And I never took more than a week off because it was too painful to get back into training. And that's when I realized, okay, I need some serious like mindfulness. I need to take care of me. This is ridiculous. And after three days of putting it in the safe, I was like, wow, this is amazing.

SARAH  00:14:40  Like, that shit's over.

CAMILLA 00:14:42  I mean.

SARAH  00:14:42  Yeah, I know, so it's it's funny how quickly you can get into something and how quickly you can get out of something, too.

CAMILLA 00:14:49  I was about to let ten days in the Maldives, like, just pass on by without. You were looking.

SARAH  00:14:55  At your phone. I know, I think we're all guilty of that to a certain extent.

SARAH  00:15:01  me? now, when I when I was reading about you, you were saying that a lot of people tend to have, you know, mental health issues throughout their lives, obviously, but specifically in the 40s and 50s, there's a lot of like, mental health peaks. I would say, you know, you have so much going on transitions, emptiness, hormones, all the things. And then when I read about you, you're like, the 40s were my fucking best. That was like my decade. That was like your mental health peak. And so I just want you to talk about that. Why it was like that, how you made it like that, and how you're teaching your clients to do the same.

CAMILLA 00:15:48  I actually have the chills a little bit because when somebody says back to you what you said, but that's true. I just turned 50 and I look, I have great I've had a great life in the way of experiences and all of that, which I'm grateful for. But when I really, truly look at my my life like I did it turning 50, I thought my favorite was my 40s because I took care of my mental health, and mental health was my number one priority.

CAMILLA 00:16:13  I can feel emotional saying this because for so many years I didn't and he came last and I was not okay, but I was out there. But you looked.

SARAH  00:16:22  Okay.

CAMILLA 00:16:23  I was out there, you know, entertaining, making other people happy. But inside there was like a void, like an emptiness. And you can see, like I feel deeply emotional saying, because.

SARAH  00:16:33  It's not like you didn't have a purpose, like you did have a purpose. The purpose was dancing and winning competitions and training and all that stuff. So what was the piece that was missing for you.

CAMILLA 00:16:45  That I couldn't put myself? I couldn't put myself first because there was no time to go. What do I want today? Right. Because I had to go perform. I had to go train.

SARAH  00:16:54  What can you eat today? Because it's like if you're eating on a regimen, you have to stay at a certain weight. You're not like, let's go to In-N-Out burger.

CAMILLA 00:17:02  Absolutely not. Wow. It was all of that.

CAMILLA 00:17:04  And you become sort of you just, you know, you're on the treadmill. And so my mental health has been my priority through my 40s. And that's felt really good. So that means that there have been days if I've not been okay, I would cancel my day or I would move things around to take time to have. I say I'm on on a bad day that we can all have a bad day. I meditate twice as much, right? Because it's needed. So I will always check in with myself in the morning and be like, how am I meaning mentally? How am I physically, how am I and what do I need? And sometimes it's like I need to go slow or I need to move some things around to I'm maybe not okay. I've listened to a lot. I listen to a lot of trauma this week. I've had a unfortunately a week with a lot of clients who've lost people, and I always think I haven't got children myself, so I like to be able to show up.

CAMILLA 00:17:56  I think I can show up extra sometimes for my clients.

SARAH  00:17:59  Already this week. And I mean, I know I'm like, oh my God.

CAMILLA 00:18:02  Yeah, so we have to take care of ourselves.

SARAH  00:18:06  It's interesting that you say that, because I was just saying to a friend yesterday is, I guess I'm an introverted extrovert or an extroverted introvert, whatever it is. Like I can go for three days. Yeah, but like after this week that I've had, like, I'm going to be like at home vegetating unless I'm flying to rescue my daughter from I have a business in Europe, but that's a whole other podcast episode. but like, I know myself. Yeah. And, like, I can go and go, but I can't do it for weeks or months. Like, I need, like, 2 or 3 days where I'm not super social. I'm kind of just at home ignoring my husband through his daily routine of whatever he's doing and all his hobbies and just kind of just being by myself.

SARAH  00:18:49  Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:18:50  And that's another thing about I resonate with that, because I've realized through my 40s that I'm a highly sensitive person. And now too. Are you seriously?

SARAH  00:18:59  So that sounds I heard you talking about that on one of the podcasts, and I was going to bring that up because you said that, like, sometimes like super noisy places and all that. That's exactly how I am too. Like the thought of being at a club. I mean, there's there's no scenario where that works for my body.

CAMILLA 00:19:16  No, no, no, because it's the nervous system gets oh, my.

SARAH  00:19:19  Nervous system is like, get me the fuck out of here. Yeah, like if I'm at Houston's, like a restaurant and like, the music's blasting, I can't function. I agree, yeah, and I don't, I, you know, you don't realize that you're probably born like that. Like I thought I was, like, in college. I still wasn't that club person. Like, my body can only handle a certain amount of input.

SARAH  00:19:43  And then I'm like, okay. Game over. Right. Shit's past. Give me the cocoon. Yeah, exactly. I'm, like, playing weighted blanket. Here we go.

CAMILLA 00:19:51  Yeah, but we can still like to do things like that. And we can still want to connect with people. But we just need a lot of self-care and self-love and time out to.

SARAH  00:20:00  So how do you define a highly sensitive person?

CAMILLA 00:20:03  So this is 20% of the population. We have more active mirror neurons in the brain. So that was something that I found really strange when I was growing up. And kind of overwhelming because I didn't know this. I just would walk into a room and I'll be like, gosh, that person over there is not okay. Like I would know, and I would want to go and take care of them. And then you sometimes exhaust yourself doing that, right? and so I feel other people's feelings and I'm sure. Yeah.

SARAH  00:20:30  And not even just my kids. I'm, like, trying to help my friend's kids and, like, it just never ends.

CAMILLA 00:20:36  So really helpful statement. for anybody that needs to hear this. Is this mine? If you ever are in a busy place and you suddenly starting to feel, gosh, this isn't okay, and what's going on over here, I feel like maybe they're having a problem, like, you know what I mean?

SARAH  00:20:52  I know, but I would be saying that all day long. I know sometimes it's really none of it. Most of it's not my shit. It's other people's. But, like, I want to solve the problem. Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:21:02  I stopped being a fixer the day I became a coach.

Speaker 3 00:21:05  Wow.

CAMILLA 00:21:06  I cannot, so I share a lot. And I've already.

SARAH  00:21:09  Arranged doctors in Europe for my daughter today. Like, I'm like, I'm already done. But, I mean, it's my kid, but still, it's like it gets to a certain point where even my husband's like, shut the fuck up. Like, this needs to stop. Like it's stopping right now because I can take it to a point where there's no end.

SARAH  00:21:26  Yeah, because I want lying.

CAMILLA 00:21:27  In and scooping.

SARAH  00:21:28  Them up. Yeah, exactly. Except I would make him fly to Milan, I think. Well, I mean, I would just supervise from my phone, maybe.

CAMILLA 00:21:34  Delegating next level. We need a whole.

SARAH  00:21:36  Podcast on that. I want that kind of a lot nicer to him. And like, there isn't as much of like a friction rub. I get the I love you via text, but it's a little sweeter to my husband, you know? But he's also not the one who's managing the stuff, you know, he's just kind of like the day to day. But it's the ice cream. Yeah, exactly. And he's 17. He's like, oh, let's go shopping, you know? But I'm the one that's like, get a refill for my prescription. Do this, do that. You know. So it's like different roles. Yeah. So, I actually think I actually think both my kids, to a certain extent, are highly sensitive.

SARAH  00:22:12  My son, though, which is weird. He doesn't have the noise problem.

CAMILLA 00:22:15  Yeah, some people don't. You can. And that's interesting because he's. Yeah. Chooses some time to be maybe in noisy environments. Yeah.

SARAH  00:22:23  but he also likes his silence. Like. Yeah. Like I remember when he was little, he would say, I really like being in the pool and underwater because it's really silent. Yet. He was deejaying at a club last night. Like, if you like what? Like you have people screaming in your ears like you're deaf. Like it's crazy.

CAMILLA 00:22:40  You could do that. You know, you can train yourself. Like I trained myself in sport and maybe he's trained himself. That's his passion. If it's your passion, you can make an allowance. But it doesn't mean that you don't need to recharge later.

SARAH  00:22:51  Yeah. No, because he does. It's interesting because, like, he'll he had a bunch of friends come from college and it's like they're going, going, going.

SARAH  00:22:58  And then I'm like, Where's Jake? And then he's like disappeared for an hour. There you go. And he does his sort of like, I'm on my bed, I'm taking a shower and nobody's talking to me. He has like the recharges built in. That's smart. You know, a.

CAMILLA 00:23:13  Power nap since I was 16. So that's my favorite thing, right? That just gets me through.

SARAH  00:23:17  My dad and I can nap anywhere, anytime. Like airplane floors, literally. And chick fil A, I mean, like, I could do it. The problem is I can't go to sleep at night, but I can sleep right anywhere during the day. Like if you were like, you can take a nap right now. I'd be like, sign me up. But then tonight at 11, I fall asleep and then at 2 a.m. I'm like, okay, let's get this party started. Oh I see.

CAMILLA 00:23:41  Yeah, yeah. So apparently when we get used to power napping, we can have that moment where we.

CAMILLA 00:23:46  Then the body thinks we're power napping at night, so we have to retrain it to say when it wakes up. It's like, no, no, this is not a power nap. Carry on. I've had to do that too.

SARAH  00:23:55  I know, but what do you do? I mean, I tell myself to carry on and nobody's listening.

CAMILLA 00:23:58  I put on like I have, like a sound bath. I have certain things that I put on immediately. I just go, okay, the body thinks I need to wake up now. It's not a power nap. So I put on some audio soundbars.

SARAH  00:24:09  Your husband doesn't.

CAMILLA 00:24:10  Care. He loves it. Now what? Yeah, you just put it on enough times, and they just. He surrendered a long time ago.

SARAH  00:24:17  Oh my God, my husband. My husband surrendered on most things. But if I was playing shit in the middle of the night, no chance. Literally. Do you think you'll notice? Oh my God, the guy, the guy.

SARAH  00:24:29  I'm convinced that he has a hearing problem because he plays piano, blasting the piano and earphones. But like, if he hears if there's, like, a door crack or anything like that, he can hear it.

CAMILLA 00:24:39  I have an idea why he likes piano, right? Yeah. So there's some really good sort of meditative piano play. I think you could maybe just suggest that sometimes if you wake up, you're going to put it on because he'll benefit both.

SARAH  00:24:51  Of you, wait for it because.

CAMILLA 00:24:52  Subconsciously will inspire him and he'll become like an even more amazing at what he does.

SARAH  00:24:58  You know what he says. Like, if I'm playing Instagram Reels, he's like earphones. Yeah, but that's annoying. I know that's different. That's completely. And I oh, why are my Instagram Reels different from your YouTube golf shit? Like, why am I listening to that out loud? Yeah. No. Like how is that okay. That's headphones that somehow more high level than my reels or whatever.

CAMILLA 00:25:18  That's headphones.

SARAH  00:25:19  Both I'm saying I'm like headphones, headphones, I don't oh yeah.

CAMILLA 00:25:23  Like that's the thing for highly sensitive people. So headphones have to be available in the house.

SARAH  00:25:28  I know my husband also likes to what he loves subtitling on TV. And I'm like oh my god that's so annoying. Like I can't because that's disturbing to you. And I also can't scroll Instagram while I'm reading subtitles. It's like a problem. You know what I mean? So it's like I need to multitask when I'm doing nonsense time. It's funny, you know.

CAMILLA 00:25:50  You should have them all take the sensitivity quiz that Doctor Elaine Aaron did just to see where they are on the sensitivity scale. It's quite fun to know that about family.

SARAH  00:25:58  My husband is not. Really. Are you sure? You know he is. I would say he is with, like, noise and stuff like that. But in terms of like having to take on the world's problems. Yeah, no.

CAMILLA 00:26:10  That's a lot for.

SARAH  00:26:11  Us. Like he does, like our immediate family, the plans, all the travel, all that stuff.

SARAH  00:26:16  But if I was like, oh, can you solve Lucy's kids? Whatever. He's like, I'm good. Me? I'm like, in the back seat. Like, you know, we can't, I don't have I don't have as many boundaries as he does. That's like something I definitely need to get better at in this age is like, yeah, Boundary City.

CAMILLA 00:26:33  Yeah, that's as I read the other day. No is a full sentence. That's my favorite one right now for.

SARAH  00:26:40  Me.

CAMILLA 00:26:41  On the highly sensitive course that I did. Boundaries has his own whole track because boundaries are vital for highly sensitive person.

SARAH  00:26:48  They're so hard.

Speaker 4 00:26:49  Though.

CAMILLA 00:26:50  But they get easier. Do you know what's amazing is when we get really good at them and you just go, sorry, I can't make it and there's nothing back. You're like, why didn't I always say that?

SARAH  00:27:02  Why did I have to go?

CAMILLA 00:27:03  I can't make it.

SARAH  00:27:04  Because blah blah blah blah blah blah. Sister in law's like, pet pig is having a heart problem.

SARAH  00:27:09  I mean, I know sometimes I'll put my kids my husband on a text and he's like, why would you give that much of an explanation? Like, who gives a shit? And I'm like, I don't know, because that's a.

CAMILLA 00:27:20  That's how much we care, but we don't need to.

SARAH  00:27:23  I know for a confident person, I kind of care too much like it doesn't. It's not commensurate.

CAMILLA 00:27:28  Yeah, that's being highly sensitive. We care so deeply and and honestly I have a lot of sensitive clients I think obviously you know like attracts like maybe in that way we can help each other. But it is so overwhelming sometimes this world.

SARAH  00:27:42  Do you tell do you tell restaurants to turn music down? I do, I don't.

CAMILLA 00:27:47  Like a draught.

SARAH  00:27:48  I don't like.

CAMILLA 00:27:48  Aircon on.

SARAH  00:27:49  My head. Yeah. I'm like, I was at the Ivy on Robertson and the music was so loud I couldn't even, like, function or think. And it was like lunchtime. And I was like, do you mind if I like? But we can't turn it down.

SARAH  00:28:04  And I was like, oh my goodness. Yeah. You know, it like takes over your whole system with no other people are just not bothered by it.

CAMILLA 00:28:12  I sit outside when possible because of that, because it helps a little bit having the sort of some sort of outside nature.

SARAH  00:28:18  Maybe I just need my own padded room. It's like a mid-life padded room, you know, for just like all my super bitchy days, like, don't talk to her. She's in her special room. Oh.

CAMILLA 00:28:30  Sensitivity is.

SARAH  00:28:31  A lot. It is a lot, and I'm not sure 100%. I'm not sure most people like understand it. They just probably think I'm a sensitive bitch. But that's okay. I'm cool with that. Well, we've all.

CAMILLA 00:28:40  Probably heard the sentence you're too sensitive. I had that a lot growing up.

SARAH  00:28:45  You're just too.

CAMILLA 00:28:46  Sensitive.

SARAH  00:28:47  Don't take it personally. Oh, wow.

CAMILLA 00:28:50  So a sensitive person. This is the. This is the fun part right. We would, we would think over a conversation for five days, right.

CAMILLA 00:28:57  Somebody who's not will go. You still thinking about that? Yes.

SARAH  00:29:01  Oh my goodness I forgot the minute you walked out of the room. I know it's like we've created this whole scenario in our head like, oh my god. Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:29:09  So meditation is vital to cutting that loop.

SARAH  00:29:11  What's your favorite type of meditation?

CAMILLA 00:29:15  I like mantra meditation or even just like words like I.

SARAH  00:29:20  Am sitting in silence, repeating the same thing over and over. Yeah. That's hard.

CAMILLA 00:29:24  Yeah, I like that.

SARAH  00:29:25  Oh, I like.

CAMILLA 00:29:26  Guided I love.

SARAH  00:29:26  Guided, guided. That's. But then some people say that's like not real meditation. Is that.

CAMILLA 00:29:30  True? No, because meditation is coming back to one thing over and over again. It's acknowledging that you have thoughts because we have, you know, 60 to 80,000 thoughts a day. Favorite fact in the world? and so when you sat there and you're noticing, you're thinking, you come back to one thing. Now, when I listen to a guided meditation, I'm not necessarily listening to every word.

CAMILLA 00:29:52  And I think a lot of my, my colleagues would say, just tune out my, my, my, my words even. But it's just like you have a guide, somebody holding space for you. But the vital thing is that you acknowledge that you're thinking and you're coming back to one focus. And that one focus can just be a breath Thinking back to the breath. Thinking back to the breath. Thinking back to the mantra. Sound whatever it is.

SARAH  00:30:14  So what is your day look like? Like in a in the real world?

CAMILLA 00:30:18  You mean now that I play pickleball, like, as if I'm a professional?

SARAH  00:30:21  I mean, not only do you play pickleball, but you play in, like, one of the hottest areas in the country.

CAMILLA 00:30:26  Yeah, like 94 to 104 last week.

SARAH  00:30:29  I mean, I don't even I can barely get to my car. I was in Miami in New York for two weeks and like, I was like dying, getting to the Uber. And you're doing a whole game and show.

SARAH  00:30:39  Yeah, like three hours later.

CAMILLA 00:30:41  our mutual friend.

SARAH  00:30:42  I mean, are you on an IV drip.

CAMILLA 00:30:45  Lemon and salt in the water?

SARAH  00:30:47  I did that this morning. It's so good. our.

CAMILLA 00:30:49  Mutual friend Susie, she, talked to me about pickleball for two years, and I said, please stop. I mean, I I'm just never going to go there, you know? Then I went once and some sort of obsession happened. I've been back every day ever since.

SARAH  00:31:05  But I don't even I played once. Everyone understand the rules. The kitchen, the this the that. It's too complicated for me. I love it. And the scorekeeping is hard too. You kind of get used to it and you've never had injuries. A lot of people I know have gotten injured, so we don't.

CAMILLA 00:31:19  Ask those questions.

SARAH  00:31:20  Ever, right? Because in.

CAMILLA 00:31:22  Dancing, we also.

SARAH  00:31:22  Never asked those questions. So you're just ace bandage and icing at night. That's cool. It just feels.

CAMILLA 00:31:27  Like the old days when I was an athlete.

CAMILLA 00:31:29  If something is a little sore, we're live.

SARAH  00:31:31  Great. And do you does your husband play? Yep. Every day with you. Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:31:36  Well, we don't always play together because, you know, that could get interesting. But now that we've both learned to a certain level, we can start playing together now. In the beginning it was interesting.

SARAH  00:31:47  Together on the same team. Sometimes either. Wow, that's you're like a skilled athlete. Dancer. Like I'm a spaz. Like, there's no way I could do that. I think we should play. Oh my God, not many people have asked me. I'm like, no, no, no, no. What about your family? I like the outfit.

CAMILLA 00:32:03  Well, I'm also there for the outfits, but don't tell anybody.

SARAH  00:32:06  Yeah, the outfits work for me. My kids. My husband doesn't really play right, because he he plays tennis and golf, so he would be so good at it. I know I think he kind of thinks it's like fake tennis.

SARAH  00:32:16  I don't know, he's a little judgmental about it. Yeah, that's how it begins. And then they try it. Yeah I know, I know that's how he is about a lot of things. But he we just were in Miami and they play padel. They're similar I guess. and he played once and then when we came back to LA, he's like looking it up, you know? You know what I mean? Do you, do you see what I mean? I don't have that need yet. Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:32:39  No I didn't either until I went once.

SARAH  00:32:42  But is that your name. But is that your main form of exercise? No, Tommy, it is, it.

CAMILLA 00:32:48  Is right now. It is. No, I, I started out with, a few years back when, when we had the pandemic, I started doing 15 minutes, 15 minutes workouts with a friend of mine who has this great.

SARAH  00:32:59  Health fitness as I read about.

CAMILLA 00:33:00  It. Yeah, Cara Fitness is her app CAA Kara Fitness.

CAMILLA 00:33:06  She's amazing.

SARAH  00:33:07  You too.

CAMILLA 00:33:08  She's a she has her own app. She's online, she's on Instagram. I mean, I.

SARAH  00:33:12  Could do anything for 15 15.

CAMILLA 00:33:13  Minutes, but not.

SARAH  00:33:14  Anything.

CAMILLA 00:33:14  Seriously.

SARAH  00:33:15  They work.

CAMILLA 00:33:16  I cannot tell you. I build some more inner strength and cardio that I could not believe it.

SARAH  00:33:21  What's the workout?

CAMILLA 00:33:22  It's different every day. Oh, so sometimes he's live on the app too. Or, you know, she goes live and or you just follow all that you should. Just like monthly challenges. Yeah. Weights. all kinds of from weight to sit ups, everything. So every day is different. So it's fun. It's actually fun. And you feel like you're hanging out with her. She's so real, you know, she doesn't pretend. Oh, yeah, I'm gonna love my my 15 minutes. She's like, oh, it's going to be hard.

SARAH  00:33:46  How much can you get down in 15 minutes? Enough. Wow. It really, really changed the situation.

SARAH  00:33:53  Yes. If you tell yourself you're going to go to the gym for an hour and a half, forget it. Like, fuck.

CAMILLA 00:33:58  I mean, you're you're very disciplined.

SARAH  00:34:00  I feel I have been much more disciplined than I have been in my for the rest of my past lives. Yeah. this past month, I haven't been great, but I was traveling for two of the week. Yeah. And in my mind, I'm like, I'm eating, but I'm walking and I'm fucking sweating and 100% humidity, like I'm fine. and then I came back and I was like, do I have a runny nose? You know, that whole thing?

CAMILLA 00:34:22  But Monday you're back in.

SARAH  00:34:25  I'm going to be back in. Well, actually Tuesday, because I have to report on Monday if you.

CAMILLA 00:34:28  Go to Italy, probably Wednesday, but.

SARAH  00:34:31  Oh my God. I'm going to Italy to rescue my dog.

CAMILLA 00:34:35  You might be going to Italy. I'm just saying.

SARAH  00:34:37  It. Well, hopefully we're talking right now and my husband's managing that on WhatsApp.

SARAH  00:34:42  Okay. That's just trusting that.

CAMILLA 00:34:44  He's handling that by booking your flight.

SARAH  00:34:46  Okay. Okay. Well he better be finding a business class seat on the best airline.

CAMILLA 00:34:52  I'm sure that's being organized as I speak.

SARAH  00:34:54  But Milan's too hot for me right now. I just did didn't mean anything. And I just had a pimple injected. There's too many things going on in my life for that.

CAMILLA 00:35:01  So 15 minutes a day is doable. Followed by ten minutes of meditation ready for the day. Off we go, walking the dogs and.

SARAH  00:35:10  Then getting the pickleball.

CAMILLA 00:35:11  No, I mean, so if I do the pickleball for like an hour in the morning at 7 or 8.

SARAH  00:35:16  We did talk about this before we started recording. Like you wash your hair twice a day, I wash my hair, maybe twice a week.

CAMILLA 00:35:23  Well, because the desert washes your hair by just you drenched, like, once or twice a day. Especially if you play pickleball twice a day. Not that I would ever do that.

CAMILLA 00:35:31  That's ridiculous. Sarah, are you suggesting that I would play twice a day?

SARAH  00:35:35  I mean, at this point, anything's possible. You play twice a day.

CAMILLA 00:35:39  Sometimes. Sometimes I start the day and finish the day with an hour. Pickleball. Wow. Or 2 or 3.

SARAH  00:35:47  Okay, I'm gonna go back to that because that sounds like a lot for me. what? Speaking of that, let's make it serious now for pickleball.

CAMILLA 00:35:57  Yeah.

SARAH  00:35:58  Is that a hobby for now?

CAMILLA 00:36:01  Yeah.

SARAH  00:36:02  I'm just saying, like, obviously you're a competitive person and you're an athletic and professional athlete to a certain extent. So like, has it become less of like a hobby and more of like you're actually going to be like in the pickleball Olympics, like, you know, they added it to college sports, I love it. I just found that out. I was like, Holy moly. Yeah. College sports.

CAMILLA 00:36:29  No, I think we talked so much about longevity in life. And there's a lot of talk about what can help things like dementia and, you know, jackets work.

CAMILLA 00:36:36  It's amazing. And dancing.

SARAH  00:36:38  Someone like me, who's like, so low level, like I have to play with 80 year olds. I mean, I could never play. Everyone's been playing for so long, I could never catch up.

CAMILLA 00:36:47  But that's what I thought. But I just played with beginners.

SARAH  00:36:50  Dancing with the stars lady.

CAMILLA 00:36:51  I had no idea how to hit a ball over the net, honestly. But you just. I find it interesting to learn. I love about it. I love it because it's actually about using the mind, right is strategy. There's a lot of strategy. So by the way, do not underestimate somebody who's 80 because they'll have you if you don't understand the strategy of the game.

SARAH  00:37:09  Yeah. As long as I don't have to keep score. But the physical parts are lie. You're moving your ass around. Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:37:15  But again, depending on who you play with, you can move a lot or not so much. You know what I mean? So it's it's it's just interesting.

CAMILLA 00:37:22  It's really it keeps you on the ball. Pun intended. Yeah. And that's what I like about it. And I'm going to try this time to keep my hobby. My hobby. Yeah. And my passion I'm.

SARAH  00:37:32  Going to say.

CAMILLA 00:37:33  Because that's what happened in the last career. It became my career. Right. And so something that I loved so much and had so much fun with, suddenly it just wasn't fun.

SARAH  00:37:41  But are you like an obsessive kind of person? I you like to be perfect. And my husband is like that. Like he picked up golf and that's his been, like, singular focus. He picked up piano like he wants it until he's like the best at it.

CAMILLA 00:37:57  I just like to have it at a level where I can have a game, you know, actually get the ball over the net. And I love the learning of it. But no, I'm not going to, I'm going to do one competition in the autumn. Just for fun. I'm just.

SARAH  00:38:13  Honestly, it's just for fun.

SARAH  00:38:14  For fun. Okay? This is fun. It's very social. Like in the Olympics. Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:38:18  No. It's social. And, you know, we talk about a lot of people sitting on their own, right? We have a lot of people feeling lonely, in our society. Go play pickleball.

SARAH  00:38:28  But you're not really talking during you do. Are you okay? In between, you take a break and dead on the ground. But yeah. No, you take it.

CAMILLA 00:38:35  It's very social. You meet people from all around.

SARAH  00:38:37  Have you gone to card games yet? In Palm Desert? Like, do you play canasta? No. Mahjong? No. You'll be there like next week. Yeah. Country club card game. Not yet, not yet. Okay. Yeah, that'll come for y'all now. So if a client. So if a client comes to you and is like, hey, Camilla, I'm 50 years old, my kids are out of the house, blah blah blah. I'm bored as fuck.

SARAH  00:39:02  What am I going to do now? Like, where do you even start?

CAMILLA 00:39:05  With the passion, I think.

SARAH  00:39:07  Okay, well, what if you were in a past flamenco dancer? You know what I mean. You're a mom and you're like, I don't have a passion. Like, for me, when people ask me that, I was like, oh, no, I'm gonna start a podcast. Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:39:18  Well, exactly. So I think.

SARAH  00:39:21  It's sometimes easier when you have a thing, like a lot of people like, oh, I used to love to do art or I used to love to whatever. I didn't really have those things. So for me, it was like school, like, I'm a nerd and so I'd like to study. I got my PhD and I like to research. So I was like, okay, what could I do with that? Oh, I'll start a podcast, I'll research, I'll gather information on the guest, but that's it. Not everyone has like can necessarily find their thing.

SARAH  00:39:48  And how do you help them find their things?

CAMILLA 00:39:50  We talk about how do you want to feel like I want to feel, you know, connected. So okay, well, there's some sort of connecting with people then what does that look like? What are some of the things you've enjoyed in your life? Well, you know, I used to enjoy sewing or jewelry making or sports or so sometimes they join. We don't know the whole path. I think that's really important to know. When I left Strictly Come Dancing, I didn't know my path. It was extremely scary. I didn't know how I was going to make a living, by the way. That was like making a living was, you know, of a new career was so far down the path. All I knew at the time was I want to explore more about the mind, because I love working with the mind myself, and I want to explore how I can use that. So that was how I began, right? What is a course I can take? That's to do with the mind.

CAMILLA 00:40:38  So when we start to ask these questions, you know, I think most people when we start to ask and sometimes that's holding space and going on, I went on a, you know, inward hypnosis journey with somebody yesterday and they just needed some they wanted some answers of some of the things that they really enjoy. And we wouldn't have gotten to that conversation. Have we not got quiet and listened. And suddenly this person is like, oh my goodness, I realize I love sports. It was just completely different, you know what I mean?

SARAH  00:41:04  What, like a hypnosis journey would feel like?

CAMILLA 00:41:06  Yeah, hypnosis is very similar to meditation, but I use the client's words, so it's not like I have a sit script. I listen to what it is that they want to explore, and then I gather all of that information, and I read that back in a hypnotic state so that when they connect with their subconscious mind, higher self, the oneness one mind, whatever you want to call it, that guidance can come in and you can be like, gosh, I forgot that.

CAMILLA 00:41:31  I really enjoy, you know, writing. I'm going to I'm going to stop writing about, you know, I don't know, cooking, let's say, or whatever it is, the people. And it just starts with these little small. I say follow the first year.

SARAH  00:41:46  You know what I mean? Yeah. What is the first year?

CAMILLA 00:41:48  Because I'm like, we're going to have our entire career, you know, outlined. They come and then.

SARAH  00:41:54  It's like the inner bitch comes and it's like, okay, self-limiting beliefs. Who are you to do this? You don't know what you're doing. You don't know enough.

CAMILLA 00:42:00  Yeah, we do hypnosis for that.

SARAH  00:42:02  Yeah. I mean, that's like a common one for, like a full body hypnosis on every single thing that's going on.

CAMILLA 00:42:08  That's that's a common one. So we start to sort of because if people say, who am I to do that? Who are you not to do that? Why wouldn't you? You're here to explore life to the fullest.

SARAH  00:42:17  I think, as so many of us are so outcomes driven, you know, it's like, well, what if I don't? It's not some huge success. Or what if I don't have 500,000 followers? Or what if I, you know what I mean? We all get kind of, like, caught up in that. I don't know, that cycle. And, like, sometimes you have to sort of stop and think, what would I do if no one was watching? I agree, and it's funny because I talked about that once on an Instagram reel, and one of my friends heard that and she was like, oh my God. And she actually started like a whole business because she was like, I'm not doing this because I'm scared of what other people are thinking. And now I'm just going to do it as if no one's watching. And she loves it. But it's that kind of putting blinders on, not ignoring. Like, it's not like you want to live your life ignoring, but like, hey, this is not about them.

SARAH  00:43:12  Like this is about me and wanting to wake up every morning and have a mission and have a purpose. Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:43:20  I like to use the words that the process or the journey has to be enough. And that really is something, I think, that I learned through writing my books. Because once you write a book, it's, you know, I might think that, oh, this is going to be great and helpful, but I don't know, once I send it out into the world, it's going to go on its own journey. So really the process has to be given to me as well as me giving to the project in like an equal, you know, formula. Yeah. And that has to be enough. Right. So I think I think that's really great what you said about your friend because the process has to be enough and we have to do it for ourselves too.

SARAH  00:44:01  And it never it never ends, never end. It's like you can always be better at pickleball. You can always be a better dancer.

SARAH  00:44:08  I mean, I guess there's certain people who are the best, best at certain things, but it has to be about like enjoying the journey because you're always get there, always be another, another finish line. Another finish line. I think so many of us get addicted to that finish line. And I'm sure you did with the dancing too, is you're like, okay, the next one, okay, the next one, okay. The next one. But it doesn't end. No.

CAMILLA 00:44:30  But my coach told me that a very early age. He said, remember to enjoy the journey because the victory is so short.

SARAH  00:44:37  Yeah. I mean, when you see like, tennis players retiring and all of that, you think, oh my God, like this has been their entire identity and existence and they're 42 years old or whatever. And now they have the rest of their lives to sort of re-identify and reshape and figure out, like, who they are, like you said, without that. And I think that's what a lot of moms feel with Empty Nest.

SARAH  00:45:00  It's like, hey, I've been like Jake's mom. I've been Baron's mom, and who am I? Now that they're off doing their own things, like, am I less of a person? Do I have to, like, call myself something? What's next?

CAMILLA 00:45:17  And I love that you always talk about that subject, too, because I think, and I say this to my class all the time, I think sometimes we, we pretend that these big moments in life are not really emotional. They're really emotional, and they deserve a moment or time or a year or whatever to go, wow.

SARAH  00:45:36  So like, my son comes, he goes and I'm like, you know, I'm like, oh, I'm good, I'm good this time, you know? But then I know he's coming home in two weeks, you know. But like, when he leaves in August, I'm like, I guess Thanksgiving, you know, it's it's different.

CAMILLA 00:45:52  I don't think we need to pretend that it's not emotional.

SARAH  00:45:54  I know that's what I say to so many people who messaged me on Instagram this this year because I didn't have someone, a kid graduating, but they knew I did last year. And I was like, cry. Yeah, ugly cry. Yeah, let it out. Go for it. Like it's coming for you. Yeah. There's no way to hold that in.

CAMILLA 00:46:09  Yeah I've been, I feel like I go on so many college journeys because a lot of my clients children now.

SARAH  00:46:17  Oh, my God, I fucking have enough with just two kids. They send that that.

CAMILLA 00:46:21  They send their their children to me when they go through college. I feel like I go on all these college experiences, but, you know, some of the most profound, beautiful conversations I've, I've had to I've been, you know, a witness to is between a parent and a child where the parent is like, what is my role now? What do you need from me and the child being, like, able to say your credit card.

SARAH  00:46:47  You know, have that conversation.

CAMILLA 00:46:48  And but but you understand that, hey, I'm just a little bit lost because I've had to be there like, you know, in a certain way. And now I'm not needy like that. So it's actually so beautiful to watch when they have that conversation.

SARAH  00:46:59  My son appeases me a lot more than my daughter, you know what I mean? Like, he'll feed me little bits of, like, updates. You know, my daughters, she's 17. He wasn't like that at seven. He's going to be 20 now. So it's like a little bit older, a little bit wiser. Yeah. Like if I text her, she'll shut the fuck up. You know what I mean? Like, if I text her, she'll be so happy if I tell her that I called my grandmother, you know? Yeah. He does a little more appeasing at this point, but I did tell you that my daughter did thank me this morning for finding the doctor in Europe for her.

CAMILLA 00:47:29  And she'll thank you when you fly over to get her.

SARAH  00:47:32  Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Are you coming to Milan? I wouldn't mind.

CAMILLA 00:47:35  You. We can stop by Denmark on the way and say hi to my family if you want. I think we got to leave.

SARAH  00:47:42  There might be some really good shopping. I hear it's hot right now, so it'll.

CAMILLA 00:47:47  Be.

SARAH  00:47:47  Great. Now when you when I was reading about you we talked about this for a second a minute ago. But I like to leave listeners with kind of like one liner mantras and little things. It was something it wasn't. It was what do I need right now. Yeah. And you mentioned that before. And I feel like that's like a very important it seems menial, but it's actually a really important, profound question. Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:48:18  And by the way, I've asked this question. This is something that came in when I wrote this. The the third book is not used me. I would go into these corporate gigs and I would get everybody to close their eyes and put their hand over the heart and say, how am I? And sometimes, honestly, these amazing, you know, strong business people, they were just like little tear because they hadn't asked themselves for so long how they were.

SARAH  00:48:45  Because they feel like shit.

CAMILLA 00:48:46  Well, they were just so stressed and busy and in the doing and they were like, how am I? And then what do I need? And honestly, what do I need can be so simple, like, call your friend, go for that. Walk that.

SARAH  00:48:59  Coffee room by yourself in your.

CAMILLA 00:49:01  Room, read that book, have a bath, whatever. But that tuning in is a really great reminder and takes like what? 30s to a minute?

SARAH  00:49:09  You feel so guilty about it.

CAMILLA 00:49:13  I don't know, I was raised the same way to just like, get on with it.

SARAH  00:49:17  Do it women. We feel more guilty about it. Like my husband has no problem. Like I'm going to play golf for 50 fucking hours. You know what I mean? Like, totally. No problem. Me? I'm like, oh my God, I have to do this. And like, Marin needs that. And like, I told Jake, I'd pick up this, you know? And he's like, bye.

SARAH  00:49:34  Yeah. And it's not that he's selfish. It's it's it's the boundary thing again. I think he just is like, this is my time. I'm a good husband. I'm a good dad. And like, this is my boundary right now. Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:49:47  I've had to train myself to. I have to still speak to myself. Camila, it's Sunday. Go do whatever you want. And you do not need to feel guilty about it, but that I've had to train myself to say and to do because you realize yourself. Well, my my husband studied hypnotherapy too. So sometimes I write.

SARAH  00:50:07  I write a.

CAMILLA 00:50:07  Script and I hand it to him.

SARAH  00:50:09  I'm trying to think of who was. Someone said that they did hypnosis with you for candy and sweets. I should probably do that. That's my. I'm not an alcohol person, but I definitely am like a chocolate gummy bear person. Tell me how that works.

CAMILLA 00:50:22  Well, I mean, you can't. You have to want to give something up.

CAMILLA 00:50:25  It's like anything. Cigarettes, whatever. You know, you have to want to not do it. And then you tell me what we figure out. What the. What is it actually that you're searching for in that moment? Sugar is an addiction. You know what I mean? That we we start to crave it. But there's often something else that we're looking for in that moment. Sometimes it can be connection, sometimes it can be love. it can be all sorts of things for people. And then again, as you speak and tell me the words, and then I create the script and read it back to you. And in this hypnotic state, and.

SARAH  00:50:53  Obviously one time is probably not.

CAMILLA 00:50:57  See, that's the thing for some people, depending on where they are on their journey, how ready they are. It can be. But also I record the track so people can listen to it again, but it really depends on obviously people who are doing some sort of mind training already, like meditation or whatever, would get a quicker result, often because they've sort of conditioned their mind to change.

SARAH  00:51:20  That whole mind body connection thing is so mind boggling. The fact that all of these things can be controlled. It's it's hard to get your head around.

CAMILLA 00:51:32  Yeah. The reason why I fell in love with the mind was when my, my coach of 13 taught me that I could sit and visualize myself doing my steps, correctly, and my mind wouldn't know if I had just imagined it or actually done it.

SARAH  00:51:48  I've heard that and I'm like, oh, so I don't have to lift weights. My body's imagined that I've lifted weights.

CAMILLA 00:51:54  Read the research. That's research on that regarding the six building a six pack. But you do have to do some sort of sort of gentle contraction. And really there's a certain amount of time, by the way, that you have to do it. So I think I'd rather do that in that instant. I'd rather do the 15 minutes, But visualization in that way is something that has I have used in my entire career in life, and I teach my clients to do because it it works.

CAMILLA 00:52:20  I imagine living here before I knew I was going to move here, and I'd never been to L.A. You know, and before I moved here and became an American citizen.

SARAH  00:52:28  I love your story about moving to Palm Desert. Tell everyone that. Well, I like it because it's about this kind of like trying new things and doing an experiment and seeing where the experiment takes you.

CAMILLA 00:52:39  That's it. My husband and I were living in L.A. ten years, and then we went to the desert just to spend a month, and we just had so much fun. We just really loved the the mountains and the peacefulness there. And as we were about to leave, my husband was like, and I never thought he would say that. Why are we going back to L.A., actually? And he didn't have to say that twice. So I said, let's ring the the Airbnb and see if they're available for a year. They weren't. So we ended up, you know, making other arrangements. But within two months we decided to go on an adventure and move there.

CAMILLA 00:53:09  And I don't know how long we'll be there or where will we? We enjoy it.

SARAH  00:53:14  I love that my my husband is definitely in that stage right now. Like, let's go visit New York. Let's go. And I'm like, we're not moving. He's like, what's his number?

CAMILLA 00:53:24  I'm gonna call him, invite you up to the desert just for a day. I know the desert.

SARAH  00:53:28  In Gulf would kill me. Honestly, I would be a golf widow in five seconds.

CAMILLA 00:53:32  But you play pickleball, you come to the club with me.

SARAH  00:53:37  I mean, that's so much hair washing for me. I don't know about that.

CAMILLA 00:53:41  I think I need to, like, you know, really ease off with the pickleball. I'm selling it hard, I know.

SARAH  00:53:47  How can you keep your skin not dry like you're out in the sun? You're living in Palm Desert and you're over 50. And you look the way you do. What's the.

CAMILLA 00:53:54  Secret? Water and oil. Water inward. Oil on the face.

SARAH  00:54:01  But you can't wear oil in the sun, can you?

CAMILLA 00:54:03  I put some on the first thing. And in the evenings. Wow.

SARAH  00:54:08  Because you would have to have a tremendous amount of hydration to tremendous. I mean, I would be like on an IV drip all the time. Yeah, you get.

CAMILLA 00:54:16  Used to it. You don't go anywhere without having, like, water at hand. Oh my.

SARAH  00:54:21  Gosh. Wow.

CAMILLA 00:54:23  And the lemon and the salt. That was a really good tip that I got given.

SARAH  00:54:26  Do you put the Celtic Celtic salt on your tongue.

CAMILLA 00:54:29  I just put it in the bottle.

SARAH  00:54:31  Oh someone told me you have to put it on your tongue for it to like, instantly absorb. So I do my tongue, then I almost choke. Yeah, because it's nasty. And then I put it in my water with the lemon. And my husband is like, what kind of science experiment is happening right now? And then I chase him with a salt and he's like, get the fuck away from me with your salt.

SARAH  00:54:51  It's like a Ziploc bag. He's like, I.

CAMILLA 00:54:54  Love your Ziploc bag. I'm like that when I try. I know.

SARAH  00:54:56  But I like he's like, when did you, like, turn into, like, Grandma Ruth? Like all these? My grandmother used to, like, carry Ziploc bags. He's like, when did you become that person? I'm like, it's just so convenient. Like, you bring your supplements, you don't have to have a box. It's just these cute little. But then I'm like the person on the trip where my kids asked me for something, and I'm like, the gross person who's taking 100 Ziploc bags out of the bag. It's not. I mean, it's not a good look, but I was.

CAMILLA 00:55:22  Practicing on Dancing With the stars. They would always be like, Where's Camilla's handbag? Because there will be some snacks in there. Yeah.

SARAH  00:55:29  Oh, yeah. All at all. Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:55:31  So I'm with you, like we're friends and my husband's.

SARAH  00:55:33  Like a klepto.

SARAH  00:55:34  He, like, steals all my snacks, steals all my shit. All the things that he yelled at me that I wasn't allowed to bring on the trip.

CAMILLA 00:55:40  Yeah. That's my.

SARAH  00:55:41  He's like, oh, do you have a Band-Aid? Yeah. I was like, oh, you need a band aid because your shoes rubbing your foot. Let me pull one out for you. I mean, who carries a Band-Aid?

CAMILLA 00:55:52  But then they were like, travel, carry on and don't bring any of it. Yeah. He's like, you have two suitcases.

SARAH  00:55:58  And I'm like, yeah. And I also have, like, all the shit that you need. Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:56:02  It's good.

SARAH  00:56:03  Now, with all of your clients in this midlife zone, what would you say are like, I don't know, like, your biggest pieces of advice, the things that you're seeing. Because I feel like there's so many of us who are like, I'm stuck.

CAMILLA 00:56:19  I think that playing pickleball. Yeah, I think we all need to change the narrative a little bit.

CAMILLA 00:56:24  I think we all have to accept that change is part of life, and every single day is a gift. I honestly hear and see so much every single day that my motto is just like I'm so. I'm so grateful for another day. And, that means aging too. So we have we know so much now about diet and tools and mind tools and meditation and all of it that we can use, and earthing and walking and infrared. So like we got lucky. We know so much for longevity. You know. Do you do the cold shower? But then you feel.

SARAH  00:57:02  Like you feel like there's so much. But like, how do you close the gap between knowing and actually fucking doing? And I think that was like one of the steps in your book too, is where you're like, okay, you like actually have to take an action step no matter how small it is or this thing is not. Yeah, your change is not coming because you have to make the little change to create the momentum.

CAMILLA 00:57:26  Yeah, but it starts with, you know, accepting where we're at and accepting that there are things that have changed in our lives. Our bodies are changing. I can't eat the same diet as I could ten years ago. I can't I've cut alcohol, you know, because it didn't agree with my body. so the action steps come by again. Listening to our body. Our body is giving us signals, right through these transformational years where we are changing and the more we can accept and embrace, because resistance is is like a block, we will resist. Like, I don't want to feel this way. I don't want to. I mean, I didn't want necessarily to give up a nice glass of red wine, but I also didn't want to feel horrible and have sleepless nights.

SARAH  00:58:07  I know I don't I mean, I don't drink at all. So you don't have to convince me. Like there's no scenario where. I mean, I mean, I would rather eat gummy bears all day long than drink alcohol.

SARAH  00:58:16  Yeah.

CAMILLA 00:58:17  Sugar. Yeah. I had to be honest, I love sugar. I had to cut it down to a little bit of a less, you know, because my body was, again, like, I'm not loving it. Yeah. So I mean, Muffin Top.

SARAH  00:58:30  City.

CAMILLA 00:58:30  So it's it's it's just really listening and embracing. And I think we're all part of changing the narratives by embracing, embracing all of it and doing the things that make us happy, like having an idea of moving somewhere. Do it.

SARAH  00:58:44  I also think, you know, I think also knowing that you're not alone. Yes. And that you're not the only person who's feeling like a little. Yeah, stock a little like, okay, what's next for me?

CAMILLA 00:58:55  Yeah.

SARAH  00:58:56  is like half the battle because I think even, like, with my platform, like women just saying like, oh my God, I thought, like, I was the only one feeling this way. it's so nice to know that there's. I mean, not that you want other people to be in your misery with you, but just knowing that it's not unique to you, like there's not something wrong with you.

SARAH  00:59:13  Like, why are you so upset that your kids are leaving? Like, why? You know? Yeah. Like that's normal. Yes.

CAMILLA 00:59:19  And I get to say that to clients, right? I get to say literally had ten people tell me that this month. It's fine. You're good, you're okay. You know, you're allowed to feel upset. Things are changing. But also, are you also excited about that thing that you mentioned that you really wanted to do when you had time? Oh yeah, I forgot about that. Like, do you know what I mean? It's like diving in and looking at what now.

SARAH  00:59:42  Yeah, it's kind of like having things to look forward to. And even if they're little things, it's like, you know, you have a dinner on Thursday with people that you really want to be with, not just the half dews. Yes. and I don't feel like you have to have like a million of them. It's just a few glimmers of things where you're like, I actually get joy out of that.

SARAH  01:00:02  That doesn't feel burdensome or annoying to me. And I feel like that's one of the gifts of midlife. I think if you embrace it is that it's like your time to say like hell no, fuck yeah, like zero Fox, the whole thing. Yeah. You know, I'm not saying I, I, I don't care what other people think, but I don't care what other people think. Yeah. No. You know, like kind of aging. Yeah. I mean obviously I don't, you know, I don't want to make it personal, but it's like this is what works for me. Yeah. And like, this is not this doesn't work for me. And that's it. And I feel like everyone has their own version of that. And part of the beauty of being this age is like, okay, you get Botox, I'm not going to get Botox, but I'm not judging you for what you're doing. Totally. You just do your thing. Totally.

CAMILLA 01:00:52  And I think that's important to like you said, you know, there are so many tools.

CAMILLA 01:00:56  Pick the tools that work for you and roll with that. I know there are many, you know that don't work for me or that I'm not interested in, but I've picked some that work for me and that's that's my routine.

SARAH  01:01:05  So it's Reiki. I read that about you. Yeah. Meditation, Reiki, meditation, sand baths.

CAMILLA 01:01:14  Infrared sauna. I love red light therapy.

SARAH  01:01:17  How often are you doing the infrared sauna?

CAMILLA 01:01:18  So in the winter a lot, 2 or 3 times a week, but in the summer right now, because honestly, it's like living your life. I can feel again. I'm in tune with my body. I get out, I get sunlight in the morning. I find that's really important when the sun is first up. just like 5 or 10 minutes, enjoying that cup of coffee with that. So I feel like I'm getting enough of that in the summer, living in the desert. But other than that, you know, I'm not one that likes to cold plunge. But if I'm.

SARAH  01:01:46  Feeling you imagine me cold plunging, I think.

CAMILLA 01:01:48  You would just love.

SARAH  01:01:49  It. Oh my God, I'd be. Oh my God, that would not be a good scene for me.

CAMILLA 01:01:53  No. So you know, but I know so many of my clients and friends who love it. Yeah. That's great. I really don't want that. I'll turn the shower.

SARAH  01:02:02  Maybe on. I do that, I know I do that. It's good for your hair too. It keeps it blow dry longer if you run the cold water on your hair at the end.

CAMILLA 01:02:10  But you know, it's irrelevant to me.

SARAH  01:02:11  Well, for me, it's fully relevant because I got to make that shit lasts for at least 4 or 5 days. So, like anything I can do to not have to do my own hair. Exactly. That's my daughter's favorite thing. Like when I'm on a trip. She was texting me from Europe. She's like, you're on date, when are you washing your hair? Have you had to wash your hair? It's like a running joke because she washes her hair every day.

SARAH  01:02:33  That's funny. but for me, it's like it's a big thing. That's amazing, I know. It's it's very high level shit. Believe me. Yeah. Now, if you had one piece of advice as we wrap up for midlife women who are trying to figure out, like, what's next and what they need and what feels good, what would it be.

CAMILLA 01:02:55  Except where you are at, except everything about the situation, because that's surrender. And in surrender that's flow. And then just follow the first. Yay! Well, as soon as I see you, I'm like, I feel like in the stomach, right? That that's fun. I don't know why, but I'm going to do it because that feels. Yeah. And see where it leads you. Sometimes it's you go to that thing, you have that conversation with someone, and suddenly you've exchanged information and suddenly you learned about a book, and that book gets you there, or this podcast gets you there, or you hear something, you don't know where it's going to lead you, but just follow the first day.

SARAH  01:03:31  It's like a breadcrumb trail of synchronicity. I've loved having you. I'm so glad we could finally get it arranged and on the books. Thank you. I hope you got to play pickleball today. Maybe you did it yet. No. Not yet. Oh, so you could play, like 10:00 at night? It'll still be 150 degrees in Palm Desert.

Speaker 6 01:03:47  Work for the.

SARAH  01:03:48  Weekend. Oh my God. Okay, show the camera your books. Okay. And tell us about each one. Okay.

CAMILLA 01:03:54  So we have. Yeah. We're here. Yeah. So this is dream believe. This is dream. Believe. Succeed. This was my first book. It's a half bio, half self-help of how I got through heartbreak and how this may support you to how I did follow my dream and it was a lot of hard work. But there's some tips and tools how to do that and get through it. Even when you think that this is never going to happen, it happened. reinvent me. Reinvention at every, you know, whatever age we needed, we can reinvent again and again.

CAMILLA 01:04:28  There's no, you know, time frame on that, reinvent it anytime. There's a lot of stories out there, people that reinvented late in life. Even so, just go for it. The tips and tools in this eight step program in there. And it's not just me. It's all about self-care and self-love, self-acceptance. it talks about the subconscious mind and how, you know, the patterns that we have from our childhood can affect us now and so forth. And also about the chakras in here. So if you've enjoyed listening to us talk about the chakras, you might enjoy this.

SARAH  01:04:58  So good. Okay. Tell us where we can find you. Okay.

CAMILLA 01:05:02  On my website then MTV or the Send Me app, or lots of other apps as well that have meditation. You'll find me on their.

SARAH  01:05:11  Instagram.

CAMILLA 01:05:12  Instagram at drop.

SARAH  01:05:14  Okay, you have to spell that for everyone.

CAMILLA 01:05:16  At Camilla drop Camilla d a double l e r. Yup.

SARAH  01:05:24  Amazing. Oh my God. Loved having you.

CAMILLA 01:05:27  Thank you so much.

SARAH  01:05:28  We shoveled through so much midlife shit with this master golden shovel. I mean, I might even have to let you take that to pickleball just to, like, make a scene. You know, you.

CAMILLA 01:05:38  Do a podcast. From your first experience at pickleball, I would like to introduce you. When the temperatures drop. We'll do it on a day where you won't need to redo your hair.

SARAH  01:05:47  Okay. That's good, that's good. It's like I have a blow dryer right after. Okay, I'll try it. I've only done it once and it was at a birthday party.

CAMILLA 01:05:54  I will personally be there to guide you.

SARAH  01:05:57  Yeah, it seems really hard, but as.

CAMILLA 01:05:59  Long as I can go play.

SARAH  01:05:59  Golf, I have a good outfit. If I have a good outfit, maybe a spray tan, even though the spray tan might run off with all that heat and humidity.

CAMILLA 01:06:06  Now we'll wait for it to go down a little. So in the autumn. Okay.

SARAH  01:06:10  Yeah, I love it.

SARAH  01:06:11  Thank you so much for coming. I'm so happy to have you. Hey, peeps, it's me again. I listen to this episode with author, life coach and champion dancer on the UK equivalent to dancing with the stars. It was called Strictly Come Dancing. Oh my god, pickleball superstar Camilla Sager dollar up. I wanted to summarize the golden nuggets for you to have actionable items to start using today. I know that when I listen to a long episode, I'm like, oh my God, I love that. But then I can't even fucking remember the specifics. This is why I come back and do a golden nugget. Summary. In this episode, we dig deep with our golden shit shovels in a conversation about midlife self reinvention, woo woo, the inner voice, and honestly, about 500 other things. Golden nugget number one thriving mentally in her 40s and 50s, the first half of Camila's life was spent training, dancing and competing. She said it wasn't until her 40s that she felt like she was feeling the healthiest mentally.

SARAH  01:07:13  She said that her 40s were her favorite, because that is when she really started to take care of mental health and made it her number one priority after years and years of putting herself last. This is midlife reinvention. Even though she was dancing and competing and doing something that she once loved, but she was really doing was entertaining and making others happy with that. While it left her feeling void and she felt this tremendous emptiness inside of her. She took her power back after so many years and finally put herself first after 40, and by 50 she feels like she was able to look back and see all the accomplishments, big wins, small wins, and the progress she made in a way that made her feel really proud of herself. Golden nugget number two getting quiet and listening. Camila is one with all the midlife woowoo practices, and at the heart of it, it's really about getting quiet and listening to that inner voice to know that you are really wanting something at that moment. And when you guys know the inner bitch that tells you, don't do this, don't do that, you're not good enough for this.

SARAH  01:08:20  You're not good enough for that. she said that this practice is what led her to leaving dance and moving forward with her life in other directions like neuro linguistics, life coaching and hypnosis, and most lately, pickleball. When Camilla is working with a client, she likes to work with the throat chakra. She finds it when people are feeling their inner voice starting to peek through. It may feel like a little tickle in the throat, or they're coming down with a cold. Or at least it feels that way. These are all the signs of the throat chakra is out of balance, and reinstating this balance would allow for thoughts to be expressed clearly. When she works with people through hypnosis, she finds that it allows the space for them to get quiet and listen to their inner voice. Golden nugget number three. The process has to be enough. It's so easy to forget this at the moment, but it's not about the destination or the final product, or the number of Instagram followers you have or the ones that you want.

SARAH  01:09:19  I know it sounds backwards, but it's not about the outcome at all. It's all about the process and the journey. Camilla says that the process has to give just as much meaning and fulfillment to you as the outcome does. It's an equal formula of give and take, and the process has to be enough regardless of outcome. It's not something that you do for 50,000 Instagram followers or a book deal. It's something that you do for yourself because when you accomplish your goal, there'll always be another goal, another goal post. There will be an endless number of finish lines, which is why it's crucial to enjoy the process of getting there. Golden nugget number four getting in tune with your body Camila prioritizes being in touch with herself on a mind body level, and to get in tune with her body and her spirit, and she implements a variety of practices into her life. She says that it's all about knowing what works for you and being consistent with that. She's picked the ones that work for her, and she's made it part of her daily mid-life routine.

SARAH  01:10:20  Camilla loves Reiki, meditation, sound baths, and red light therapy. She also loves to enjoy that ten minutes in the morning when she's having her coffee. So do I. She says that when you're out of tune with your body and your subconscious alignment, you will know it and feel it. When this happens, it's best to accept where you are in your situation and surrender because surrendering will always put you into flow. We go through so many tools in this episode. I'm so excited that you just listen to it. The gold is dripping off these nuggets. Grab it, use it! There are three things you can do. First, fucking subscribe to the podcast. Second, share it with some friends who like midlife shit. And third, write an Apple review. I know it's annoying. It's an extra step, but guess what? It helps a podcast grow. You think your little review doesn't matter, but it does. And you know you guys can watch this episode on YouTube. Okay, DM me.

SARAH  01:11:14  You know, I always respond. Oh, and of course follow my Instagram at the flexible neurotic duh. Love you talk soon.