“Candid AF” - Midlife Masterclass with Jennifer Fisher

Sarah Milken (00:00.366)

They've all been in the summer and they've all been in the heat. What do you got?

Sarah Milken (00:08.334)

I'm not gonna take this call. Do you carry that around? I have a little one. I don't need that yet. You don't get hot? No, I mean I get hot. I don't even think mine's just like a menopause hot. I'm always hot and sweaty. I'm just used to it because I have thyroid disease. So I'm always hot and sweaty. But I also was on tamoxifen so I know what it's like. yeah. But this feels nice. I'll take this. Yeah, it's amazing. I should have put my hair down. I don't have time.

I just didn't have time for powder. Am I looking? well. I don't? No, I don't want oil. I don't want to be too powdery. I'm okay. You look good. I like your hair darker. There's nothing about the darker hair for us ladies at our age works for us. Please keep this on during.

like almost like eggplant. Well I had like white hair and then I...

Sarah Milken (01:17.806)

My hair was too black. I was platinum, let me turn turn off. I was platinum and I... What was the last time? What did we do? Was during COVID? Was it fucking COVID? Was it really? Is this the first time I've seen you? I know you look amazing. What'd you see? What'd you see all the new sh*t? sh*t? doing two -tone. These are the smaller one. Yeah, we're doing these in different sizes now. You need them. them. need them now. Did you get me this water from Chinatown Deli? Thank you.

Sarah Milken (01:50.196)

It's perfect. How long you here? these are the Fisher cuffs and you can do them in any letters that you want. We have a thin like me. No, I don't. I'm a tiny rest. I mean, not really sweaty. Sorry. Don't mind this. The New York sweat. We still have a fucking manicure. good.

I don't get those thank God. I have friends that get them. No thank God. I'm like watch I'll get one. Watch I'll get one. I can't do any of that stuff but I know what it feels like because I did it's amazing. That's a standard size. I think it's a six and a half. Yeah you do need it sorry if I rip it off you.

Sarah Milken (02:38.381)

You get used to it here. It's always like that here. It's actually not. It's not so. Are you going to stand up? Are we sitting or standing?

Sarah Milken (03:11.213)

Once you sit and start chatting and all that stuff, you kind of get used to it and you don't really sweat as much except under here. It's a little sweaty. Do you have crotch sweat? No, not really.

Do you get under boob sweat? I get under boob sweat. I was just saying that I have. Check your video. You can see my under boob sweat. see, we have under boob sweat. I do, too. I almost put the powder on. You don't look oily. Why is there Ditas on here? ew. Wait, what is happening? What is that? OK, we're doing that again. I don't know. But I do. Show us your under boob sweat. I have under boob sweat. I have it, too. It's real. It's New York City. It's 90 degrees. I know. Why are we here? I actually bought real deodorant at CVS instead of the non -toxic one.

the tour I love it the black one it's amazing it does not it works yeah it works it's good yeah we'll talk about all of it and see how do we want to do the shoes let's see here how's my angle

Sarah Milken (04:24.749)

I love that you come with your own fan. It's so nice. I love that you come with your own fan. I know. It's a big Midnight fan. It's called Bronzer and Spray Tan. I'll tell you all about it. no. Well, I'm actually getting one before this weekend. I haven't had one in a really long time. I actually don't look so.

This is like my natural face. But you're LA. I know. I have a dripping nose. OK. I wore heels for you today. you can see my under boob sweat. No, you can't, because it's shadowed by your boobs. I feel like this camera's always up your face. Why is that? This is the worst fucking angle here, always. No, I just feel like it's always coming from here. Here, switch with me. See, you're like this.

Sarah Milken (05:16.924)

No, no, no, but he has two cameras. It's perfect. He has two cameras.

Sarah Milken (05:31.501)

I see I'm normally never on the side so I'm awkward. This is not my side. Woo! Sweaty, betty. It's actually so you get better when you sit down and you relax. You stop sweating as much. Just chill. Yes.

We did a little furniture moving around. Did you? Yeah. Set change. At least it's black in here. When I came in, when I came here like a couple years ago, it was like blue. Is that the other room? wait, we talked about changing this to a pink light. What happened?

Sarah Milken (06:06.637)

I'm gonna be in a pool of sweat. You'll be okay. It's okay. Are those four inch y 'all? Yeah. Of course. My boutique is I wear them all the time. They're really comfortable. But they're not four inches because it's a giant platform. So it's like really like an inch. It's lower than yours. It's an optical illusion. Is this recording, Will? Yes it is. Okay. Because we have to talk about like if you're shrinking and you're wearing those with your husband, that's fucked.

I mean, poor guy. I mean, we're all shrinking and then you're wearing four inch Bottega platform. Yeah, I'm shrinking, but he's not. It's so fucked up. Like, I don't know why I'm suddenly. I mean, I've always I always wear really high heels. I know. That's why I wear these for you today. I always wear really high heels. And when I don't like I had on little like mesh ballet slippers earlier when I was at the office and everyone's like, you're so fucking short. And I was like, I know. But how tall are you really? I was five eight. Now I feel like I'm five six.

Really? Interesting. I think I've shrunk that much. See, but that's kind of scary for me because I'm 5 '2 .5", like at my peak. You're like younger than I am, right? How old are you? 49. Yeah, you're younger than me. I'm 53. Okay, so I'm just going to keep shrinking probably. That's cool. Yeah, probably. But my daughter's over 5 '6". I feel really small next to her. I feel really small next to both of my kids. It's weird. Both of my kids are bigger than me. It's weird. Both of them are bigger than me. Both of them are...

We'll talk about it. It's crazy. Are we getting started? Yeah, let's do it. Okay. Do I, I don't even know. Do I talk to the camera or you? Okay. We'll just talk to me. I can't see myself. So whatever. It's okay. Huh? Do you have a fat roll? Do you want to see yourself? No, it's fine. There you go. Now you can see yourself. I was like, Wolf, do you have a fucking filter? Like a Paris filter just to like take the rawness out? It's like a lot for me. And I have like a studio is very bright and I have a pimple. we can't see it. The pink light. That's cool. Okay.

I don't know. It blows us out a little bit. We're old. Yeah, that's what I, that's the term term I use, blow out. And he was like, what are you talking about? Yeah, brighter light. It blows us out. That's what I said. It's like a Paris filter. Yeah. I was like, blow us the fuck f*k Yeah. It's great. I mean, whatever. Okay. Should I switch my bracelets to this side? Okay. Let's do it. Let's talk. Who are you? Let's do it. Okay. Hi everyone.

Sarah Milken (08:32.013)

This is Dr. Sarah Milken, The Flexible Neurotic podcast. I flew my ass from LA to New York City and just coincidentally got Jennifer Fisher the one fucking hour that she was free this week. She had so much going on. Who's Jennifer Fisher? Of course you know who fucking Jennifer Fisher is, because if you don't, you're living under a rock. She is, let's see.

I know like jeweler, entrepreneur, badass woman, midlife hottie. Let's see what else. Kitchen influencer, chef, amazing salts. Everybody wants to buy what she's wearing, do what she's doing. Her Instagram's humongous, social media amazing. She has two kids around.

My kids' ages, one's off to college last year, just like mine. Second one, Drew, what, how old is she? She's gonna be a senior. Same as me. For some reason, I thought she was a year behind, but she's not. No, our kids are the same age and the same sex. Introducing Jennifer fucking Fisher, if you don't know her. Hi. my God. Okay, so we're just gonna just acknowledge the boob sweat. Well, it's 90 degrees here in New York. Yes, and we're on black velvet chairs. Right, but it's not like we're just sweating. It's hot outside today, so we're running.

Yeah. I'm used to it. Yeah, I'm not. LA, we don't really have humidity except for like maybe 10 days out of the year where it's just a hot box. Today doesn't feel humid. There's a breeze. It's actually kind of beautiful today. Yesterday was amazing because yesterday was beautiful. Yesterday was breezy. I felt like I had an armpit ventilation happening. Yeah, no, here today, it's just when you're rushing around, you have to do like this. You're running hot and it just... And I'm going to have like crotch sweat.

But I get yeast infections, you don't, we already covered that. I don't, yeah, that's weird. But they've actually slowed down because of the vaginal estrogen, which you can't take. I can't take any of that sh*t. It's really gonna suck for me when I'm in the position of having to really take it. I literally have my period right now, so I'm not there. my God, I don't even get my period because I take birth control pills seven days a week, but my daughter got her period last week and I was stressed and we had so much going on.

Sarah Milken (10:46.381)

that I got a special period just to sink with her ass. And I was like, yeah, I was like, this doesn't work for me. Like I can't. And then my son flew home, like from summer school, they had a day off. So why not fly from Philadelphia to LA with four kids and stay at my house? So it was kind of like teen daughter, the period, the house guests, all of it.

But you have to love it too. At least you have a kid. I had to keep the puke till my son's rug the other night. I hear my door like fly open at like two in the morning. I hear like the rattling in the hallway and then it's like, I can't. I can't. What I do though is like I come downstairs earlier than my husband sometimes when my son's home because I know that. Then you know what's gotten him. Yeah and I know that it didn't get cleaned up and I want to save him.

from the, I'm very disappointed in you, Jake. see, see, we have very different kids. So my kid was like, I rolled out to him at like, to him when he see what was going on and he had the Woolite carpet cleaner already in his hand. It was cleaning up this other kid. my kid would clean up, vomit, yes. But the pizza box, the water bottles, the hydration powder. Cleans it up. Yeah, for some reason, I think they were so past the point that night that it was on the kitchen counter.

I think he knows I'm gonna get so pissed if it's not and I'm so manic at home and cleaning up the counter. So if you write down, I'm very much that mom that thankfully they respect that about me, that they know that if it's not left pristine, then I'm gonna be pissed. Well, I just keep saying it's not a frat house. Yeah, well, that's the thing. And he's like, but I clean up at other people's houses. I was like, here's a fucking trash bag. It's not that hard. Is your son moving into the frat house next year? Mine is. No.

Sophomores, I don't think sophomores do that. they do where my kid goes. Yeah, I think junior year is like showtime. Yeah. And that house, you couldn't pay me to live in those conditions. He's living in like a five room, at least I love his roommates. His roommates are amazing. I got so lucky. I don't know about you, but the first year of college. I don't know. Sorry, I don't want to like. Yeah, no, let's do it. But my, I.

Sarah Milken (12:50.797)

my son got really lucky with his roommates and the moms were cool. my God, I talk to my kid's roommate's mom a hundred times a day. And like it's summertime and I'm still talking to her. Yeah, well we're talking because now we're, cause they're living together their sophomore year. And so now we're, we're prepping the room and talking about the furniture that we have to buy. Cause the frat house has new furniture and it's like, what are we buying on Amazon so we can spend the least amount of money? Cause we can get trashed. No, I know. And like, what are we all coordinating with? And like, how little can we spend? Cause it's just.

It's so gross. It's really disgusting. Yeah, it feels wasteful too. I'd love to have something that you can donate all the furniture after the year. I know. My son actually, yeah, they do kind of student housing, and then he's convincing me to maybe live in an apartment. It's so many things. All I'm going to say is that I'm so blessed that he's having such a great time and that he's...

doing what he needs to be doing. And he's met like really amazing kids because he had this kind of like unicorn high school experience where he had that like pack of friends. And I thought, f*k, he's never gonna be able to replace that. Not to replace, but to have that again because it was so special.

And he actually does. And I'm like, and the, I got - You You -lucked. I didn't go to high school with my son. He went to a really small school. Yeah. And so on Saturday, when my husband and I flew out, I'm getting pictures and it's the high school friends, the college friends all together. That's nice. And they built a beer pong table in my backyard. That's so nice. Yeah. Home Depot in my backyard. So I was like, that's really cute. I love that. But like - You're You're gonna  your grass. Yeah. I go, that sh*t has sh*t come off the grass. You're gonna ruin your grass.

And he's like, okay, I put it behind the garage. I was like, fine, it'll be in the trash by the time I get home. But it was just nice seeing that he could kind of meld his friends together. And it's a very unique kind of experience. And I thought it was very cool. My son went to a concert last night, actually, sort of on that. And he saw his friends, he went with his college roommates in the city at MSG. And then he ran into a bunch of his high school friends. And it's just...

Sarah Milken (15:09.933)

It's nice to see the kids mix the friends with the camp friends. I mean, West Coast kids don't really have the camp friends like the East Coast do, but the camp friends are also like another really great outlet. my God, amazing. One of my son's best friends from high school, he's roommates and best friends with one of my son's best friends from camp. Do you know what I mean? It's like such a small world and it's so nice. Let's talk about Empty Nest for a second.

I know, I wanna talk about that. That's like half empty nest. Where are you in that? How do you feel? Well, first of all, I wanna talk to you about it, because I wanted to bring this up, because I don't know if a lot of other moms had the same experience that I do, and I don't know if they did, and that's why I wanna talk about it, because when my son left for college, and I don't know how you felt about yours, because of his unicorn experience, I was really excited for my son to leave and to go to college and to spread his wings, because he didn't really have the ability to do so, going to such a small school in New York City.

And he didn't have an extensive, huge group of friends. And I was really ready to drop him off at college. And I was sad for a second when the car pulled away. And I was sad when I got home a little bit. I actually stopped drinking for a little bit, because I was sort of like, if I'm sad, I don't want to drink too much. And I actually, it was the best thing that I ever did, kind of dropping him, letting him go, not reaching out too much.

just letting him be. And he fully blossomed and completely changed as a human. He's a completely different person than he was when I dropped him off at school. He's social chair for his fraternity. It's amazing to see. And I credit it, I think, by not helicoptering him a little bit, kind of letting him go and doing that, and not being so like, hey, how are you every day, and kind of just letting him be. I'm not giving myself credit for it. I'm just saying I was really ready to let him go.

And I don't know if you feel that way about yourself, but I definitely felt that about mine. I think that's kind of different. I wasn't ready to let him go, but at the same time, I know exactly what you're like. I didn't want to, but at the same time, I kind of already had to because he already was kind of an independent kid in high school, kind of always part of the family, but also doing his own thing at the same time that I never like read report cards. I never like followed up.

Sarah Milken (17:24.397)

Like I wasn't chasing him to do sh*t. Like, I don't know, he just kind of got it all done, even if it wasn't exactly my style or if it was at the last minute, but he was a pretty like independent kid to begin with. So I didn't feel like I needed to be like, did you do this? Did you do that? Did you do this? He would probably have a different perception of it, but I felt like I really did like pull back a little bit, but I had already pulled back a little bit in high school because

I think he had such a strong friend group. Yeah, he didn't need me as much because he had this group of friends. And his unicorn high school experience was definitely different. Like his elementary school experience was not fun. It was like small school, kids not as nice and I don't know. It just, it didn't come as easy as easily. And then when he decided he wanted to switch schools,

everything changed for him. But I credit him too, because he was the kid who hosted. He was like, come to my house on Friday. That's nice, at least they were the mom that would do that for those kids. my God, these kids have lived at my house since seventh grade. And now the kids in Philadelphia are flying to LA. I had the same kid come twice in two weeks. I mean, do you know what I mean? That's nice, so you wanna be that house. I wanna be that house, and it's not the house that's, I mean, I describe it as being trash in a frat house, but it's more like,

those kids know that I'm gonna be there and that I'm going to be forcing them into conversations in the kitchen. You know what I mean? I text them, I'm like, hey, remind Jake who's gonna fucking forget to do X, Y, and Z. No, I'm like, I know everything about these kids. So it's nice. They know what they're getting themselves into.

for sure. But they like it. Otherwise they wouldn't come back. My husband's grumpier. He's like not as chatty. Like he's nice for five minutes. And then he leaves the room. Yeah and then he's like. That's how I am and then my husband is like you. okay. He like stands around the kitchen and wants to talk to everybody and I'm like great, peace see ya. totally. I'm like taking pictures. My husband is that they're talking sports, he's talking music, he's talking sneakers, he's talking everything with them. my god we were like talking about girls. I was like okay let's get into it. Opposite. yeah.

Sarah Milken (19:44.301)

Hilarious and my husband's like, okay, I gotta go play golf. I just wanna have the attention span for it. I'm like, okay, bye, bye, I gotta go. I know, but that's how I get my information. I know. It's like, Jake is actually, he shares, he's a sharer with me because I think we just have that relationship. That's nice. Where, I don't know. He's more like you. Yeah, I kind of, I really wanted that relationship with him. He was like my first kid.

and I really wanted him to feel like he cared. Shane Shane that with me, we're just very, we're very, we're quiet. It's funny, people think that I'm not quiet, but I'm actually kind of really quiet. I know, you don't strike me as quiet. I'm kind of quiet. In those situations, I'm not sitting there asking them a million questions. I'm just not that person. Interesting. I never have been. I'm digging your sh*t up. I'm sh*t like, hey, hey, hey. No, my husband's that one. I let Kevin do that, my husband does that. But what's funny about my husband is like, when I come upstairs, he wants all the dirt.

It's like he cares. but I'm the same way. I'm the same way. I'm like, so tell me what? my God. But I'm not the one to ask the questions. my God, he won't know all of it. And I'll be like, wait, I forgot to ask you. What was it, you know? Yeah. It's so funny. But I will give him credit. Like my husband does this like jacuzzi time with my son, because my husband goes in the spa every day. Maybe it's like an old man thing for his back. I have no idea. I don't go in the jacuzzi because I feel like I'm going to get a yeast infection.

So I skipped the jacuzzi, but a lot of times if Jake's home, he goes in with him and they're in there together. So then that's when I dig for information that I potentially didn't get. So Jeremy kind of gets like the dad kind of view. Maybe I'm not digging enough. Yeah. Well, it's not like there's that much that's that interesting. I'm just, I feel like I have the moment. So I need to like take advantage of that. When does he go back to school?

He just came home for four days and now he's back at. But when does it wait so he's always back. No so now he's back at school for two weeks taking a final coming his home on like July 9th or 10th. I have no idea when this podcast is coming out and then he goes back to school like.

Sarah Milken (21:44.877)

I don't know, end of August. I'm not the mom who knows the dates. see, I'm the mom that knows the dates. I booked that. I only know that because of what I honestly, though, one of my son's roommate's mom, she's amazing. And she's like, she'll text me, she's like, did you book this? no, no, that's my room. That's what I have, too. I'm going to do it. She's the one who's sending me the Amazon link. She's like, add this to your cart. yeah, no, that's what I have, too. I literally am the mom who's like, wait, what? I don't know. I get everything done. Did I book the hotel yet? She's like, I don't know. I'm like, OK.

But I don't, I'm not a good, like, I don't read the emails that are 10 pages long from school. I don't do that. I don't do the group texts. The group, the pledge class text, it's hard. They're all so sweet, but it's hard. No, I just get the roommate's mom, like, we're friends, and she, like, and she has an older daughter. It was two of them in a room? See, I had four. no, Penn, it was just two. My son lived with twins. interesting. Identical twins. my God. And another kid, yeah, and they lived in this, like, party room. no, this is like,

just a little dorm room. Yeah. No. But they had those rooms where all the kids freshman year at my son's school, they live in this one dorm. Most of the kids from New York, it's this one place that all of the kids from the city go to. And the party room is the corner room with the living room. A lot of the other rooms have that. They don't really have like that. this is no common space. This was literally. like the fridge next to the bed, that kind of thing. Yeah. Like how you envision it is what was there. Yeah, which is normal.

Yeah, and like the bathrooms like in the hall and there's... Down the hall or in the hall? Well, they just happen to be on the corner. So the bathroom's like right across. Okay, so it is outside of the... yeah, it's not in suite. This is like old school Ivy League from 2000 years ago. Like that should need... Like you should carry your shower caddy down the hall. yeah, it's like nasty. Ours was nasty, but at least it had a bathroom. And the bathrooms are not air conditioned.

neither of them. And they don't have toilet seat covers. So when I got there, I was like, this is like nasty. There's no way boys are going to put toilet paper on the seats. And the shower is in the same room as the toilet. Like, you can't, only one person can be in that bathroom at one time. So like somebody takes a sh*t and then the next person's in the shower. It's like nothing makes sense. So I actually ordered toilet seat covers. You did not. Yes, I did.

Sarah Milken (24:05.229)

I ordered toilet seat. Did you use them? Yes. And I put them in. We're so grateful. I left them in the bathroom as a community item. It wasn't like. Wait, what were the other community items in the bathroom? Well, I bought a little fake plant. Was it like a bat mitzvah? Yeah. I bought a little fake plant. I bought a battery operated fan. And then they like, the RA got pissed and was like, whose stuff is this? And everyone's like, I don't know. I don't know.

But it looked like a jail bathroom. I had to like pep it up a little bit with like a $9 fake succulent plant. I didn't even do that. Ours was so gross. I had a fan. It was like a fan like this. I think I probably put up a new shower curtain. I just needed to like zhuzh it up a little bit. They realize how, listen, it makes them appreciate home so much more. my God. When it's that. And it's like anything at home. He's like, Mom, don't worry about it. And I'm like, I just, because I remember how you were living next to the spitting.

air conditioning, like spitting like rust onto your bed. It was so fucking gross. I got hosed too. You got the worst bed in the, in like the whole configuration of the two bedrooms. It's literally like off the party room next to the spitting, rusting, disgusting air conditioning. He has some like nasal problem. He had like congestion. And you're like, we like the mold. The mold. I was just going to say the mold. I can't, I'm having like hard palpitations with the mold. I know I'm like.

Could my daughter do that? But they have to go through, like, it's, I mean, it's, it's a red epist and the fraternity. The frat house is going to be so interesting this year too. My son is, what is he, is he pledge social chair? Pledge social chair. Yeah, we had to negotiate a little bit with that. I was like, you're not doing that and you're not doing that and you're not doing that. So we like negotiated down a little bit. Because he already is a DJ, like does his like DJ stuff for the fraternity. I'm like, I feel like that's a no. That's a lot.

You know what I mean? I feel like you have to do some fucking homework. Like this year with the pledging and all of that stuff, like thankfully he did well. My son did really well too. I was actually really proud of him. I was like, your executive functioning stuff has really paid off. Yeah. He's really like, he had got it together. He studied. He has a girlfriend. she can't talk about that. Sorry. I did not say that. We'll delete that. Yeah, we'll delete that. But they change. It's so, and I don't know how your daughter is though, being.

Sarah Milken (26:20.077)

home with you guys. my daughter's over being an only child. My son, my daughter is so over. She's like, it's like lonely. No, no, mine's like this only child thing. I'm done with it. And we went on a 16 day college trip with her and she was like, I didn't sign up for this sh*t. She's like, where's Jake? Like I have to do this by myself and she has a boyfriend. And so she was like, I'm left my boyfriend. I'm trapped with my parents for 16 days and my brother's not here.

I remember when you did it with your son. right. She went on that. Yes. So it was the same. Right. We did the same thing with my daughter, except he wasn't with us. And she was like, this is like a nightmare. But we did get our own room. I can't believe that you did that for 16 months. I know. My daughter has barely seen school. She doesn't want to do it yet. no. I didn't see any schools before I went to college. Neither did I. Neither did I. Why do we have to go on a 16 day vacation to take our kids to go see them? You know why? Because with her, I was like.

I just want her to feel like she saw what she needed to see and she's making like, she's a different kid than my son. So she was able to see like all the schools he saw. We saw Wisconsin, like we saw the big schools. She loved Wisconsin. So did he. Where does she want to go to school? I wish I knew. She's a girl. It's like, I want this. I want that. No, I don't want. And I'm just like, let's not think about it this summer. Just do your sh*t.

and we'll revisit this in the fall. You don't have to make a decision for early decision until whatever, like it's due on November 1st. I don't know if it's a girl thing, but I didn't feel it with my son, with Shane, but I feel it. I don't know, maybe it's just like different schools they went to. My daughter goes to a pretty competitive school here in New York City and the schools are like, they do a giant disservice for these kids mentally by like posting about who got into where. And it's like all Ivy schools and it's like, it's kind of horrible.

to be honest, and I think for these kids' mental health and the anxiety it gives these kids, like I would think it's growing up now. I would think it's growing up now. My son did not have that anxiety, but I think it's a boy, and I think that's just who he is. I'm not saying my daughter doesn't just think it, I just don't like the pressure that they put on these kids now. But my daughter's definitely a stressor. With social media and the opening of the... ⁓ yeah. Opening of the... We didn't participate in that. And then the bed things, you know, those parties, did they do that in LA, where it's like everyone comes to their house and they bring them a piece of swag from the school? yeah.

Sarah Milken (28:39.085)

I've seen it on Instagram, but I don't, I can't. All that stuff, stuff, an East East thing. Yeah, I've seen it. I just don't participate in it. I gave my kid like a bin with some Skittles that were red. here you go. My son actually said to me before he applied early, he was like, don't buy sh*t. That's so weird. I'm not wearing it to school. Like, shut the fuck up. Did f*k your  commit right away? No, because he got deferred. see my son, it was funny. My son didn't and he...

was really indecisive because I think he was convinced that he wasn't getting into his first choice, which is so interesting also with these kids. So then they have to sort of decompress from all of that and kind of really try to, okay, do I really wanna go where I thought that I wanted to go? Well, cause it was interesting. So he got deferred. It It him a long time to commit. And then he had already applied to a bunch more schools, but then he thought like, fuck, f*k, better apply to some more. So then that was a fun Christmas. How many schools did he apply to in total? I'm making this up, 20.

I know, I don't know. And then he ended up getting into the school that he got deferred from, but then he also got into another really amazing option. And I was like, are you sure? Are you sure? You can still not, you know, whatever. But he knew what he wanted, he knew what he was getting into, and he got what he wanted, and I'm really happy for him, and I hope my daughter...

you know, gets what she wants in her own version. Are you ready for her to be gone? No. Are you guys ready for them to be gone? It's gonna be weird. So weird. I'm gonna be empty nested 50. That's next fall for me and for you. It's weird. My husband and I are like, what's happening here? I know it's gonna go really fast too. Like I feel like now that like, now she's starting to, you know, August is for all of her essays. I mean, her main essays. I know. But then for the rest of all of her work. And I feel like summer is gonna fly. It's gonna be August before we know it. And I feel like it's like, it's gonna be like,

the acceptance letters and things like that. It's gonna be like boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, and then they're gone. I know, and I was just talking to two friends. And then moving two into school, like what, in two different states? I know, I was talking to two friends last night at dinner here in New York, and I was like, yeah, I have to figure out, I need to switch from birth control pills to HRT, but I'm not doing that in this six month timeframe. Like, I'm okay right now in terms of how I feel, that like, for me to take that gamble of like,

Sarah Milken (30:58.765)

Is my hair gonna fall out? Am I gonna be a fucking bitch? Like, am I gonna lose lose mind? I'm like, I am not doing anything major for the next six months. Because that whole college process, it's, even though I'm not doing it, it's like just the energy of it. It's time consuming, it's stressful, it's annoying, all the things that I'm like, I gotta just keep my sh*t sh*t I know, it's hard, it's a lot. It's a lot. It's a lot.

It's a lot. It's a lot. I know. And I feel like my body's changing now too. It's so funny. I don't know if it's with the stress of work, the kids and all of this stuff combined or what it is, but I feel like I'm like running on like every single cylinder in my body right now and my brain. I like, do I need to go on ADHD medication? Like, what do I need to do? Cause I don't take any and I clearly have it. I'm not professionally diagnosed, but I spoke to my doctor this morning about it. And I'm like, I wonder if I need to go on meds. Cause I, the stress level is making me so

Like, but that can also make you, you have to find the right one because that can make you very frantic -y also. I know that's what I heard too. So I don't know. I'm just better being naturally frantic in manic. Maybe I'm just better the way that I am. But I also feel like you're in a position where you have an infrastructure, like you have a team, assistants, your husband's, like the CFO, like the old. Yeah, but we're, you know, we're in the middle of transitioning from a smaller company to a much larger company. And it's a lot. It's a lot.

It's overwhelming, it's a lot. But it's fun, but it's also really stressful, but it's also, you know, it's everything all at once. Do you ever get imposter syndrome? Like, who am I to do this? Am I really doing this? Pinch me? I get a lot of like, you know, I'm grateful to be here and I'm excited that I have the opportunity that I have to be here. But I feel like I've been training for this moment my entire life. I heard you talking once and saying like,

dude, I've been doing this for 15 years. That's not like I started the company two years ago. And I really appreciated that you said that because so many women who are wanting to do something, if they're not already and doing another thing in their lives, kind of the second act are like, but I can't look at her, look what she's done. She's so big, but you're like, wait, I've been doing this for 15 years. And what a lot of women don't understand is that they have to just start and they have to not, people are like paralyzed.

Sarah Milken (33:11.757)

by fear of ego and rejection and all of that. And you're gonna continue to have it if you're sitting there on your couch or if you get up and do something, so fucking get up and do something. That's my whole thing. And I talk to so many women all the time about, they're like, well, I'm just so scared. I don't wanna fail. I'm like, I might fucking fail every day, every day. I think every day. I know, when I was coming here and I texted you, I was like, she's gonna fucking say no.

She's gonna be like, I'm so busy. Like, why the f*k am I coming to talk to you again? I've already been on your podcast. But my point is, is like, so what's the worst that could happen? You're like, I can't do it, sorry.

Yeah, but also, and I read this, there's a lot of these quotes out there, and of course, I have my personal Instagram account, and all I do is I love to just post. I love them too, because I see a lot of the same ones you do, and I'm like, my God. So there's one that, it was something about, if you look back in a year, and it's like, there's like the, God, sorry, there's like the giant circle of like, it's such a big deal, and then it's like in a year, that's what it, it's like a little tiny circle. It's like, that's what it is, and so everything, we make everything so big, and my husband says this to me all the time, I'm constantly conflating things, and he's right.

because I'm like, well, there's so much to do and I have to get it all done. And that's just, we're all the same. I know. My husband's, I feel like Kevin and Jeremy could be best friends because I feel like they live with two, I feel like they live with two women who are very like kind of like big and high maintenance to a certain extent with a lot of stuff happening. And they have good listening skills. Yeah. And they,

I feel like my husband always says I never give him compliments to his face, but he hears them during my podcast. So here we go. I know it's like a backhanded. He's like, that's like a backhanded compliment, whatever. But he has the ability to compartmentalize. He's like, why are you fucking like thinking about Marin's college thing for November right now? Like they're here today. What's happening today? What's happening tomorrow? Where the f*k are you? Why are you here six months? Why are you in six months from now? Yeah. I talked to, do you know Gabby Bernstein?

Sarah Milken (35:09.005)

So I'm good friends with Gabby Bernstein and she's, thank God, my personal life coach and we're good friends. I mean, that's really lucky. So I texted her, I was actually gonna talk to her at 1 .30 today. And I use her app all the time, which I think is fucking amazing. I see you talking about that. It's fucking amazing and I'm not paid, I'm not, it's honestly, it saved me through one of the most stressful periods of my life. You'll have to get her on my podcast. She's amazing. I would fly back just to interview her. She's incredible. I will introduce you to her, she's absolutely amazing. But her, just her tips of how to just take a moment and breathe and take a moment and.

and remember who the f*k you are, and remember that you f*kn got this. And it's all of those things that we have the tools. We just have to stay quiet and be grateful and listen. I'm a big believer in the power of personally just, I know I can do it. And yes, that doesn't mean that I'm not scared. That doesn't mean that I'm not terrified. That doesn't mean that every day that I think that I'm not going to fail. But I just know that I can do it.

We all can. But were you always like that? Yes. OK. See, I am too. And that's the thing is I think a lot of women are like, but I don't have the confidence that you have. One of my friends last night at dinner was telling an interesting story about how she felt like she is a quieter person, potentially less confident, like kind of always off to the side a little bit. And she was saying when she hit 50 and it was COVID and she started exercising, she sort of had the opposite.

thing happened to her. You know, a lot of people in COVID kind of like shut down a little bit. She kind of grew and was like, I'm fucking 50. I'm owning my sh*t Yeah. And I'm, I'm doing it. And she's like writing a book. She just got, you know, she's getting published, blah, blah, blah. And she's like, I am owning my sh*t at 50. Whereas before I never did. 50 is really powerful. And we need to talk about that. I'm turning 50 in February. 50 is, well, I had, I definitely had a midlife crisis and I definitely like went through this whole crazy like thing of like,

wanted to dress sexy and do all this stuff, and do all this stuff to myself and all of that, but it's definitely empowering to be in your 50s. It's much better than 40s. I thought 40s were great. I didn't have my 30s. I thought 40s were great. 30s, you're really busy. I was having kids, I was getting married, I was doing doing this  but 40s were great, but 50s, you don't give a sh*t anymore. You don't give a fuck. And f*k. can, not like you, like you, you can fail, succeed. It's just like, this is my path and this is my journey and this is what I do.

Sarah Milken (37:35.117)

like it or not, you don't have to love it, someone else will. It's just like, it's this weird sense of confidence and really like, I just don't give a f*k anymore what people think. But then sometimes you're like, well, you know, you've got some days and you're like, well, there's so much to do. And you also wanna make sure that you're not being like overly confident for your kids. And like, you know, you you to make sure that you strike a balance, but you're like, okay, I am a human being, I do fail, I don't do things perfectly. Like I'm not a perfect parent.

You know, it's all of those things that you have to, you know, it's balance. I could not agree more. I mean, I I I love what you just said about like the kid thing. For me, I grew up in a house with a working mom who was a CEO and like, I did, I checked my boxes. I went to an Ivy league school. I got a PhD. I did all those things. And I decided to be a stay at home mom after all of that. And my parents were like, what the fuck f*k happening here? And I kind of just.

I kind kind went with it and you were doing you. I was doing me and like that's what I wanted at that time. And then I got to the point where I'm like, I'm itchy as fuck. f*k. have to do something that's like my own. That's not my kids. That's not my husband. sure. I'll start a podcast. I have no idea what I'm doing, but they're so great at it. How many many have you done? I don't know. Maybe like 120. But I also feel like no one knows really what they're doing.

No one. And that's the thing. It's like, I don't know how to do a podcast. I'm just a good talker. I ask questions. I'm annoying. I'm a researcher. But you're a doer. But I'm a doer. You're a doer. I think you're sort of like a doer or you're not a doer. And I think some people don't care if they're a doer or not. And that's OK. Like, you know, us doers, we just we do it because it's naturally who we are. And I don't think you can force people to try to be that. You can't.

But what I also - And not everybody needs to be like that. I agree. And that's the thing I find interesting about this whole journey is that you don't have to start a company. No. You don't have to start a podcast. You don't have to write a fucking book. You don't have to do any of those things. And you don't have to become like a muscle body or bikini model or any of those things. But you just have to find something where you want to wake up in the morning and like, you look forward to that. Something that's outside of a spouse, your kids.

Sarah Milken (39:57.261)

You know, I always talk about, I have friends who play pickleball, friends who play mahjong, all of those things. They're finding joy in whatever they're doing. Yeah, and it's not any different than what we're doing. It's just a different version of it.

Yeah, it's just being interested and interesting. And half of the people who are doing that would never want to do what we're doing. Ever. It's like exhausting and like, it's horrible. People are like, you're sending DMs, you're interviewing people, you're reading their fucking books, you're writing an essay basically for every podcast. Like you have to be on Instagram all the time. Like it's a lot of different things. Also like being a woman is really fucking hard. And like it's, you know, having to be all of these things all at once is exhausting and...

You just have to find grace in yourself and that we're all really, really different and we have our own paths and not one is better than the other. Stop comparing yourself to other women. I think what's think what's I talk about this a lot, is if you're at a dinner party and someone's like, what do you do? And the woman who's a stay -at -home mom like me for a thousand years is like, fuck, I f*k, that question. Do you hate that question? I hate it.

I got it all the time. I mean, now I'm like, I have a podcast. Hardest job in the world. I understand, but it doesn't... It just feels weird. Like, it's like you... Because of how you were raised? Yeah, I think probably because how I was raised and also like everyone wants to at some point be able to say like, I do this or I'm that. And I think at this point in our lives, like you should be able to say like, I'm a self expansionist. I'm curious. I'm like...

lifting the dumb weights, I'm researching the best supplements for my own body, whatever it is, it's like this kind of the game of zero fox. And that's sort of what we need to achieve here. You know? I think other women have to be kinder to each other. my God. That's another thing. Women are really, really - It's like high school. Unkind and horrible to each other. And I don't have any patience for that. And I think that's why I don't have like a million girlfriends. I've got a really tight group of girls that are my friends that I trust and I know and I love.

Sarah Milken (42:04.333)

You know, it's difficult. And especially being a woman in business and woman in the fashion business, like it is like brutal. Cutthroat. it's brutal. But you know who your people are. It seems like. Yeah, I do. And like you probably keep it pretty tight. Like you're very social. I mean, you're out all the time, but those are probably. I'm not out as much as you would think. Really? A lot. Yeah, everyone's like, you're out all the time. I'm like, I'm really not. I mean, I'll show, I don't show everything also. That's another thing. Like people don't know, you know.

It's funny, Instagram and social media is a funny thing. I know, well - I'm home a lot, I'm cooking dinner before I go out a lot. My daughter said the other night to her boyfriend, she goes, you have to understand, I was raised by two home bodies. That's so funny. You guys never go to dinner or socialize? Yeah, but she was just saying that my daughter's a foodie. She loves restaurants and food and cooking, everything that is not of interest to me.

Like I don't care about restaurants. I don't care about food. You're right, exactly. I love her. She wishes that like you were her mom because she has those interests that I don't. Yeah. You know, but it was just, I took that as a compliment in a weird way. Cause I was like, okay. No, it's nice. Cause you were there for them. That means I was present. You were there for them. And I was there. No judgment, but that's what I wanted to do. And I continue to do that. Like Mike, I said to my, the college friends who were home, I was like, I just want you to know, like I canceled every single thing for this week.

to be home so that like if my son asked if I wanted to go for sushi for the 48th time for lunch, that I would be available. But it's what I wanna do. Yeah, yeah, that's great. And that's what I think the beautiful part of midlife is, is like, you can do it any way you want. Yeah, totally, because I'm not like that. I'll be like, go with your fucking friends. It's funny and it's like, it's...

We all parent so differently. So differently. But I've never cooked a damn thing. Ever. Right. So it's like that's how we all show our love in very different ways. Yeah, exactly. My love language is I show up and eat sushi for the 48th day and it's 80 degrees outside and I want to die. Where do you guys go in LA? Blue Ribbon, in the Palisades. He loves Echigo, which is this little hole in the wall in Santa Monica Boulevard. yeah.

Sarah Milken (44:25.357)

But it's like warm sushi. I love warm sushi. Yeah. And they know his name and it's like the lunch special is, it's kind of expensive, but like the lunch special, you know, you get this great deal as he says, that's on my credit card. that's another thing we could talk about college. my God. There's no fucking budget. I was like, what the f*k? I looked down and it's like.

$38, starting to pay, we're like, whoa, whoa, we need a budget for next year. year. know, and with pledging, he was like at Home Depot buying wood. I'm like, making my coffee at home, man, and like, I see you like, you're like, I'm not, no, this is like not happening. We had like lumber charges from Home Depot, and I'm like, what the fuck f*k this? For the beer pong table. Well, that was for LA, but for the fret, I guess he built like a DJ platform stage. How did he learn how to build all this stuff?

I know for a Jew, it's weird, right? I know, it is weird. I know, it's so weird to me. He's just a creative -ish type. That's great. And he's like, I just want on YouTube. Like, he's just crafty. And my husband's like that. I would never even credit. That's amazing. I mean, my husband doesn't want to fix the fucking toilet or the washing machine, but he can like...

He programmed our whole house. Like the shades go up, the shades go down, like all the sh*t. Like I don't have that kind of brain. Yeah, I don't have that kind of brain. But like a washing machine, he's like, just call the washing machine repair guy. But anything else, he's like all over. I'm like, okay, have fun with that. He's like, isn't it great that the lights go, like at 5 p and you're talking in the kitchen and the lights automatically go down. Yeah, like yeah. That's nice. I know.

And he's like, you don't appreciate it. I'm like, whatever. I know. He's smart like that, I guess. Okay, everyone wants to know all the things about you. Hair, makeup, skin, supplements. Let's get into it. Okay, what do you wanna know? Okay, hair, you're dark now. I am dark. I am dark, yes. You were a hottie blonde for a while. It was not a hottie. I looked back at photos. I actually got my eyebrows microbed at the end of the day and Perrette, who does my eyebrows, the eyebrow doctor, she's amazing.

Sarah Milken (46:28.429)

in New York City, she pulled up a photo of when we first met and I had like bleach blonde platinum hair and I was like, f*k. It was one of those things like, why didn't my friends tell me at the time how bad it looked? My daughter kept telling me for years, she's like, mom, your hair is not a good look, it's like too blonde, but you don't see it on yourself. You don't see it on yourself and you're like, I'm like, this is the best hair style I've ever had. This is so good. I'm like, this is forever. Not a good look, but like I told you before we started recording, I was very dark for my wedding, like darker than you.

This is actually lighter. I was really, really dark. It looks darker when it's pulled back, like it's because it's so hot and I didn't want to wear it down. I know. But this is like four -nailed LA blow -dry. The problem with the dark hair is the, well, at least yours is still, the best dry shampoo is Crown Affair. I have it. It's the best. But now that my hair is so dark, and I literally am like one of those people, I don't know about you, but I have a hair that grows onto my face. so do I. And so they have to have the hair color. I get it. I was like, they are too weak. So I'm like, guys, it's coming in again. I need to, my hair is growing fast. And I don't know if it's from the supplements, all the taking, I mean, I'm taking Marine Collagen.

Sure, magic, I love that stuff, amazing. I was a divine college. I order it because of you, I haven't started yet. It's amazing, I love it, it's making my nails stronger, my hair's growing faster. I was taking Nutri -Full for a long time and I stopped. Does that have a weird smell? I don't know, I just don't, I wasn't sure if it was doing anything and I wasn't sure so I just stopped. But I'm taking, my gosh, you know what we need to talk about? I just did her podcast, kind of.

It's kinder thoughts. It's - ⁓ yeah. I saw that. Like the orange -ish pills. It's saffron. It's high dose saffron. Okay. And it's pills. And then there's a latte, warm feelings. It's fucking delicious. I look forward to it every day. It got me off my second cup of coffee too. interesting. I'll have to interview her. She's amazing. I'll introduce you to her too. But her company is great. Will Cole recommended those supplements to me. Cause when I was really stressed out, I was just going through some work stuff and I was like super stressed. And Will was like,

I'm like, try this. And I asked a few people about it and people were like, yeah, yeah, I don't know. I know, because you don't know. Yeah, I don't know. Saffron. And I started taking the pills and I was like, I don't know, but I feel better. Even if it's just your brain? If it's psychosomatic, whatever. Yeah, who cares? OK, but I feel better. The lattes are delicious. I'm probably taking less supplements now than I was a year ago. I've tried to tone it down a little bit. I'm taking Juna Gut Stuff. I like that company.

Sarah Milken (48:49.997)

I'm taking BodyBio. I have that. Her stuff's amazing. Jessica, you should have her on the podcast. She's incredible. Her supplements are amazing. And now I'm taking like Maca for the perimenopause. That's what I'm trying to do. And how's that? I've just started it. Because I'm every, it's so funny. I take Ashwagandha, but I don't know. It's like, I take like 25 things and people are like, how is that working? I'm like, I don't fucking know. It's like a midlife stew. I know exactly. You don't know what's what. It's a joke. Yeah. I'm like, I know. And every morning I'm like.

I'd say, how am I gonna get these down? And I literally just throw them in my mouth. I just did massive blood work. So we'll see. I'm getting ferritin IVs, because my iron is low. That's another fun part of having this. I know, I'm having my iron really checked in this last round of blood. Ferritin works though. It's kind of weird, but I mean, you go in for IVs and you literally feel better. My daughter has low iron and they want her to do that. She's like, I'm not.

It's not a big deal. Okay. Like honestly, no one should be scared to do it. Okay. Honestly feel so much better. It takes your iron levels up pretty significant fast. Like how many times you have to do it to get it depends on your iron levels. Like I was really, really low. I was like at like a 12, which is horribly low. but, and then like you pop up and you'll, you'll sort of, as you, as you go through them, I think I've had six, six in the last like four months and it's, I, I, you start to kind of even out. Does it constipate you? No.

interesting, because I know that pills, like you couldn't sh*t for two weeks. It's weird. I hate those pills. They're terrible. The IVs are the way to go. IVs, I'm gonna get it. Okay, that's good to know. Because she was like, I'm not doing that. No, it's so not a big deal. You go into like an infusion center. It's not a big deal. I just think it depends on... Do you ever feel like with a daughter, you like, like my son, I can be like, stand on your fucking head sideways. And he's like, okay. And then I tell my daughter, I was like, the doctor said, and she's like, I'm not doing that. And I'm like, okay. I find my doctor, my daughter to be a little bit more...

when it comes to like diagnosis of stuff. She doesn't love, she's like, what is that? And I have to kind of calm her down a little bit. My son's a little more relaxed about that kind of stuff. Blood work, my son has no problem with. My daughter doesn't love it. That's exactly what we have. But it's like, it's cause my husband held her down when she was younger to get a shot, cause she didn't want to get a shot. I surprised them though. yeah, no, I did that once with my daughter at a dentist and they pulled her and she's never let me forget it. I fucked her up.

Sarah Milken (51:12.877)

Jake was in town, like I said, last week and I was like, yes, I can like, so I got the phlebotomist, is that what a phlebotomist is? Yeah, the blood taker person. Shut up at my house. Yeah. Shut up at my house. Boom, boom, boom. So the night before I text Jake, he's out with his friends. I go, no food or drinking after 11. He's like, that's really annoying. I was like, sorry, that's how it's working. I tell my daughter,

the same thing and she's like, that's really annoying. I was like, but Jake didn't complain. I know, but the chick showed up at my house. There was no argument. They didn't even have to get in the car. I'm like, I can't make this easier for you. And my husband's a pain in the ass too about it. So if the lady shows up at my house, there's no like negotiations. It's like everyone just getting it done.

Yeah, I'm definitely the - My kids are my doctors. I just don't, I don't surprise them after I did that to my daughter, because we knew the doctor, there's like one tooth that was like hanging out that they had to pull and then the doctor like handed her a toy afterwards and she just was not - My kids have had their wisdom teeth taken out. My daughter had -

My daughter had deviated septum, like literally could not breathe, was like snoring her eyes out. Like it was so bad. Like she had the whole inside of her nose. I know, I wonder if my son needs to get his checked. But I was like, is it the mold from the dorm or is it something serious? my God, no, God, no, understand. I took her to five doctors over the course of 10 years and nobody could figure out what the fuck was f*k on. There  deviated septum? And I took her to this doctor in Beverly Hills and he's like old school, like kind of, I don't want to say ornery, but like very...

And we walked in, he shoved the camera up there. She didn't make a peep, she didn't negotiate. He was very firm and he was like, you have this, this and this, and you can do this, this and this, or you will have these like consequences. And she was like, okay, sign me up. And I was like, I wish that she was - It wasn't the famous Dr. Sugarman, was it? No.

Sarah Milken (53:08.717)

It was, I can't remember his first name because I have no brain, but it's Dr. Shnitman. He's in one of those like old school Roxbury buildings. No, that's like Dr. Shnitman. Yeah, yeah, I know. My husband went to him. Yeah. Yeah. My mom introduced him to his wife like back in the day, like a million years ago. my God. And she had her adenoids taken out. I had those done when I was younger. my God. And now they're like, well, you might have to have your tonsils taken out too. I'm like, okay. There's always something. There's always something. Yeah. It's so funny. And I'm like the Sherpa. Yeah, but like the younger girls that like...

before they have kids at work for me, I'm like, just take your time, take your time, because once you do it, there's always something. Always. Always. my God, I just got the reminder for my fucking mammogram. I'm like, didn't I just do this? I have my next week. I'm like, didn't I just do this and it was a year ago? I know, you have to. Get your mammograms. And I get the ultrasound too every time. I do too, because I have a pin in my right one, because I've got dense. But, yeah, so do I. And I have implants. And my, I feel like mine's like an extra.

$250 for the ultrasound. But for me, I just, I'm fortunate that I can pay it and I just do it. But my friends who don't do it, I'm like, just do it. Like it's just that one little extra step. I think if you get to a certain age, and like the doctors here in New York kind of force you to do it. Like my doctor, yeah, I didn't, after a certain age, my doctor sort of, it's like every time you do it, you don't even really have an option. But after I...

after I have the, you know, got the pin put in. It's obviously every time I have to monitor it. And you did the Pranovo too, right? I did. I haven't done that yet. I did the gallery thing where they use like the expensive blood tests where they test for a hundred cancers or something. that's interesting. Yeah. It's called gallery. I haven't done that. Yeah. You should do that tomorrow. For sure. Yeah, for sure. But then my list.

But then my doctor was like, well, if you're going to do the gallery, you might as well do the Pranova. And I was like, my God, I'm going to be like that person. Pranova was great. It was great. You know, I'm just because I sort of just wanted to know, well, A, they reached out to me. And B, I wanted to know. I was like, you know, I'm going into like, my company's getting bigger. We're making some shifts. I want to make sure that I'm like healthy for like this next phase. And there's some strange growth somewhere.

Sarah Milken (55:15.693)

So I mean, I told me all the things that I already knew. We're definitely doing it. My husband goes along for the ride with the health stuff. There's other versions of those MRIs. There's different versions of them. I have a friend who's a doctor that does them here in New York and he thinks his machine is better. Yeah. Interesting. I think it depends who you talk to and your opinion and do your research and go and do. I just think it's nice to know. I also was one of those ones that I wanted to know if I had the BRCA gene. So I spit in the tube and did the whole 23andMe thing and.

I wanted to know about the Alzheimer's gene, which I do have. I have one of them too. Yeah, so do I. And I wanted to know. I'm just, I think you're with those people too. It's like, you want to know or you don't want to know. I know, but have you seen The Notebook? Yeah, no, yeah. Did you see that? Yeah, I have seen it. Okay, I cried the whole time. I went two nights ago. We bought the tickets that day. And because the woman with Alzheimer's, that sent me over the edge. And I was like, my God, is that going to be me? And my husband's going to be the one who doesn't have dementia because he doesn't have the gene.

He plays piano, he has fucking 80 hobbies and I'm like, is that gonna be me? I know you can't do that though. I know, but I couldn't stop the tears, Jen. It was just a natural response. You can't do that with a husband thing. You can't do that. I looked at Kevin the other day and I was like, ugh. I know. Like, I sort of just sneeze, I'll be like, you okay? And it's that weird, you can't go there. I know, but I didn't mean to. I saw a show. I started crying. We're so loved enough that we care. I know, but I started crying within 30 seconds and he's looking at me like,

like, can you not make a scene? But I cried the whole time. It was like the love story mixed with the dementia, mixed with the husband taking care of the wife, even though she had no idea who he was. And my grandmother had Alzheimer's. It's just, my God. I know, it's scary. It's scary. It's hard. But after I found out, I talked to Will and he's like, listen, he's like, just because you have it doesn't.

I know 75. I think there's some crazy statistic that 75 % is not gene based. It's lifestyle based. So that's, can we talk about the anti -inflammatory? Yeah, we're going to do that right now. That's the biggest thing. And that's part of the reason why I started, I mean, I started it for other reasons, but it's really changed everything in my life by eating this way. And I, it's, it was one of those things that I, I know we talked about it before on the first podcast. That's okay.

Sarah Milken (57:37.869)

It was sort of the beginning of me doing it. That was a while ago. Yeah, two years ago. Yeah, I mean, I've really evolved kind of out of it now into like a different, I don't do grain, I don't do dairy, I don't do legumes. I stay away from nightshades. Wow. And now I'm going through a thing where I'm really trying to up my protein. Can we talk about midlife and protein? Fuckin' shoot me. I know. I'm like, should I just eat the cow? The whole goddamn cow? I'm not liking the way my body's responding to red meat. I don't digest it well. I digest...

birds, although I don't like eating birds and fish, much better. And, you know, eggs, of course, but it's like, how many fucking eggs, how many hard -boiled fucking eggs can you eat? But they're like, eat 30 grams of protein per meal. And I'm like, I don't like what that's like seven in an egg. Yeah, I'm like, that's a lot of food. I know. And then people ever messaged me, what protein powder do you like? I'm like, I like to chew my food. I don't like to drink my food. Me too. But I add protein powder in my oatmeal. I don't eat oats. I know. But then,

I just had a woman on my podcast that's gonna come out and she makes a product called No Oats. So it's a higher fat, more fiber and more protein. What's it made out of? I haven't tried it yet. What's in it? I don't even know. It's like something that you talked about once, I think like basil seeds, chia seeds, the zen basil stuff. I think it's like that kind of, she sent me the packages, I just haven't made it yet. Okay, it's delicious. I mean, if it's, yeah, I mean, I love, I love.

The woman who said basil's amazing, she's so sweet. It's the no oats version. Okay. And it's actually called no oats of oatmeal. I just haven't tried it yet, because I got it literally the day before I left for here, and I wasn't going to bring it to the hotel room and try to refrigerate it overnight. I'm not that... like a yogurt kind of thing where you just pop the top and you eat it? No, you actually have to make it the night before, typically. well you can just do that with basil seeds. Yeah. Sorry, nothing against... Yeah. No, I just have to try it. I have to try it. Okay. Yeah, they're delicious.

Listen, whatever it is that satisfies you, for me, I love eggs. I love eggs. That's why I started my salts, because I couldn't find anything to put on my eggs. But then I also love, for lunch, I love a salad. I can't. See, but I can't eat a salad for lunch. If I eat a salad, I'm eating a fucking cheeseburger after. really? Salads, they just don't.

Sarah Milken (59:54.701)

do it for me. But I also, I do, my salads I do with like a bag of like grain free chips. Like I do that. So you have some crunch factor. Yes, I have to. If I just eat a salad on its own, like today at work I made tuna and I took it to work and I like portioned it out for two days. Do you sync up the whole office? That's so nasty. No, I have my own office. No, but I'm just saying like doesn't the tuna smell up the fridge? No, and I immediately, no, and I immediately, no. Okay. I don't know. For some reason my tuna doesn't smell as good as that. Okay. It's just.

If I make tuna, my husband's like, that is just nasty. Well, no, you have to like rinse everything out and you have to clean everything. And hard boiled eggs. Yeah, and you immediately have to wash everything with soap and everything. It's a whole thing. It's a whole thing. But the protein thing is real. I've been trying to eat more chicken. It's hard. It's really hard. But then you're going to eat clean chicken. Like you want to eat it. Like you're meaning like the organic, all of that. It's hard when you go out. You're like, you know where that fucking chicken came from. I eat a lot of raw bar when I go out.

I eat a lot of oysters when I go out. I'll eat a lot of fish. I mean, and if it's wild, you know, obviously I try to. It's hard with the shrimp cocktail and they don't normally know where those come from. Exactly. You're like, is that wild? And they're like, what? It's a shrimp cocktail. I know some places do. I know. Some places know and they'll tell you. Yeah, like I said, I don't like eat a steak. I don't eat a burger. I don't crave that stuff anymore because it makes me feel like sh*t. That's so funny. I had a steak last night for dinner. How do you feel today? I'm fine. Yeah. I don't, I'm not.

I'm not like crazily impacted by food choices for some reason. I'm sensitive. Yeah, that's what I think. I'm sensitive about everything else, but the food, I don't know. Yeah, I really, it's my brain. Like, and I think it's because I am so like all over the place and I'm, my focus is really hard to like really like to stay focused. And if I eat off my next day, it's really hard and I'm foggy. Alcohol does the same thing for me too, but I love to drink. I say I don't drink. No.

I have other issues like sugar. Like I have Swedish fish in my bag. Like when we're done, I'm stuffing those down. I know, but I don't want alcohol. So for me, it's like my alcohol. Like you would have a drink and I would eat six Swedish fish, maybe 10. I didn't know that you didn't drink alcohol. I didn't know that. But it's not, I'm not against it. I just, my body doesn't want it. And when I drink it.

Sarah Milken (01:02:08.205)

I'm awake at two o 'clock in the morning. I know it's the worst. It's so bad. my God. I feel so much better when I don't drink a special drink. I know. And my husband doesn't drink either. We're like the nerd house. That's great. You guys probably sleep really, really well. Yeah, except my son like now is like, OK, we're and I'm like, OK, I'm not looking. We're just going to like leave that one at the door. You let your kids drink in the house?

My son never drank in high school. He was the one kid who had his friends and everyone drank, but he didn't. Maybe because we didn't, I don't know. My daughter doesn't drink alcohol. But he didn't drink until he went to college. My son drank the same way. That ship sailed, my son. That ship has sailed, for sure. Yeah, he walked through, they went to a concert last time. He walked through my kitchen holding a bottle of tequila. I was like, okay. Yeah. Okay. And now he knows, well, the thing is, I think with the whole fraternity thing.

He had to let a lot of his health stuff go for a while, because they were busy. But now he's back into his normal fitness routine. So the alcohol and the working out two hours a day, they're not a good mix. And so I think he's very mindful about what he's drinking now. And he's like, OK, well, this is a little bit better for me. It's a smaller amount. It's not as...

toxic, I don't know, I don't drink so I don't. I mean, alcohol is not good for you. There's no way around it. It's not good for you. It's not good for you. Yeah. But I've always liked to drink. That's like me. I like a cocktail. My friends, we like a cocktail. We all meet where the Tribeca Trotters, and that's what we call ourselves. We meet for drinks on the roof of a. Love it.

restaurant down here and it's just I would have a drink just to be there just to decompress. Yeah. Yeah, like in that kind of situation. I can totally see. Yeah, I was like hang out. But for me to have a drink with my husband and then go home and go to bed and be up at two in the morning like that's not worth it to me. I'm like, no. Okay, let's talk about like the Botox, the filler, all the fucking things because I know that we what do you want to know? I go to Dr. Dan Belkin here in New York City. He's amazing. I love him. He's my friend.

Sarah Milken (01:04:15.693)

He's adorable on Instagram. He's the best. best. literally the best. He's like a laser specialist. He's a Mohs specialist if you have a skin cancer problem. He's incredible. He does great injectables. He does very light Botox, which is why I like it, because it's not, although right now I have a lot. I feel like my body's eating Botox. It is. What the fuck f*k happening? We've gone through this whole cycle where where he's - I I saw you  that. God. It was It was funny that  doing that. And I was like, my God, I'm going through the same thing. I just made her switch from -

like the Botox, so what's it, Daxify? Daxify, there's like so many different versions. But my body ate that too. Yeah, it's really hard. You get to a point where I think you've been doing it for so long or you just get to eat. Yeah, I'm like. I don't know what happens, but like, yeah, all of that. I just cut that off. I know. I'm like, yeah. Should we talk about that? Sure. I take it all the time. you do? Yeah. I've never heard you talk about it. my face? Yeah, Dr. Kat Chang in LA. She's amazing. She's incredible. Face flip. Jason Diamond Mini.

Mini, okay, sorry, mini. Yeah, because after when I started eating anti -inflammatory, I lost like 16 pounds of inflammation. It wasn't really, I don't really look different, but like my face, I guess it's sort of like the natural version of like what happens to people like that are. The ozempic face. Yeah, it's weird, but like I did it without doing that. I did it with food, but my face really changed and it really dropped and I wasn't happy. So I changed it. It was my 50th birthday gift to myself. Excuse me, I'm turning 50 and I'm literally like, I'm in it.

Jason Diamond told me two years ago that I was a candidate for that. Jason Diamond does my filler in my face. Don't let anyone, don't think that once you get a face lift that you don't need filler, you do. I know, that's kind of interesting. But no one talks about that. People should talk about that. I have not had filler for two years. You're great. I need to go. You're great. I texted him the other day and I was like, I know I need to come. He's the best. I know, I was like, I know I need to come, ba ba ba.

But I also ride that line because my daughter is like, if you turn into like one of the housewives, you know, the real housewives of whatever, like if you ever have that kind of face, I'm just going to die. And I'm like, OK. So I really am trying to be cognizant of the not overdue. So I kind of tend to err on the more conservative side. I think a little here and there. Like when I did my face, like it wasn't, no one really thought that I looked, I don't look different. I don't remember.

Sarah Milken (01:06:35.277)

It's like, it's just a little. How was the healing? I panicked about that. It was so easy. It was easier than getting my boobs done. It was literally like nothing. It was nothing. I was back at work five days later. Really? Yes. I had sunglasses on and like my hair was down. But she doesn't do the facial, like Jason Diamond puts like a structure in your face. She can do that. she does a lot of stuff. Did you have that? She added a little something here for me to kind of like square off my jaw. Okay. Jason sharpens it all the time too. Okay. So there's lots of tricks. She's incredible. I love her.

She's great, she's young, tiny little hands, she's young, she's incredible. I love Jason Diamond too. Jason was on vacation. When my timeline came in, I was like, Jason, I'm like, Jason, I can't wait.

I know, I think I might have to get like a serious job to pay for that. I told my husband, I was like, I think that's like the 50th birthday gift. It is. Is that face up. I mean, listen, people are doing it younger and younger and I think it's your face, it's your body, you're here for not that long. My mom did it around this age, like after my wedding, she didn't want to do it before my wedding because she was afraid that like, what if she turned out looking like...

a crazy person. You just have to do your research and the hardest part and I say this all the time is finding the right doctor. 100%. The moment I met Kat I was like done great she got it. And you recovered in LA? I recovered in LA. Yeah. It's funny because some people have like 10 days. Really big responses and it's like they're down for a while. Well no but a lot of people do I didn't mine was really minor like I didn't do like a giant full thing and I didn't do

the CO2 on my face that a lot of people do. do. didn't do a brow lift. I didn't do any of that shit. shit. sh*t. what'd you take? Your neck and your extras? See, I have all this extras in here. Yeah, here. Yeah, my neck and it's probably already time for another. I did my neck and I did just like the lower mini face part. But it was like nothing. There's no scars. It's like, I always say it's like cutting that little piece of fat off the side of your breast. your breast. yeah, he's  years ago, he's like, Sarah, you have two inches. I was like, okay, I got it. And I have like...

Sarah Milken (01:08:33.741)

that kind of like Italian soft skin. So no matter how many times I pick up my boobs, how many times I fill my face, that sh*t just falls. Yeah, it happens to all of us. I mean, listen, it's a slippery slope. And once you start, you kind of like, now I'm like, it's like, do I do it in my lower eyes now? And I find my my it's like, you know, something like that. And I I know women are  critical of other women doing it, but I feel like we're at the age where it's like, I'm not doing it because I want to look good for you. I'm doing it because...

I want it's not about being insecure. It's like, it's like, hey, I don't like the way I look. I'm going to change it. I'm going to look a little bit like it. What's the big deal? I don't understand. Everyone needs to be in their own lanes politically, aesthetically. It's like pick a fucking lane. Like some people are like, this podcaster. Yeah, it's like this podcaster is like a bro and this it's like, then don't listen to that person. Don't follow that person. Yeah, exactly. Like it's like the negative energy and it's like you're going to get

negative and positive no matter what you do and it is what it is. And it's like, it's just. Do you feel like you've taught that to your daughter too? I do. I feel like I have too. I do, I do. Like my daughter, Marin, will say to me like, blah, blah, blah. My daughter's stronger than I am for sure. And like, I feel like she has that in her now. Like she doesn't have to be invited to every single thing. She knows, like I'll be like, that person like just had a 10 person like birthday dinner and I wasn't invited. Like.

And I've been saying those things for a long time because you have to normalize real life. So many kids are not self -aware too. And it's also like parenting and it's like, it's all of those things. Like you just have to teach them the skills that they can make it on their own and make those decisions and not feel bad about themselves. And I mean, listen, it's like - I know, can you imagine sorority rush?

My best friend's daughter just went through it and actually had a really good experience. She did? Where was she? Yeah, but then I've heard USC. And then I've heard, you know, I've heard other experiences where, and my nieces had a great experience at UT. And, you know, it's, I think it just depends. It's so random. But it's also like, it's sort of like the class the kids get in school. for sure. My kids had the most amazing elementary school classes and peers, and we had the best parents. And then while my kids went to middle school and high school, I, you know, my daughters,

Sarah Milken (01:10:46.797)

class age I didn't think was the most supportive group of people and females. That's why when I said my son's unicorn experience, it's because he had a group of kids that were just easy and cool. Whereas I feel like my daughter's grade, she doesn't have that as much. It's not as fluid. But maybe it's just our kids are different and maybe it's nothing to do with those other kids. Maybe with those kids that's what they are and our kids are just different. 100%.

I don't know, my daughter is so independent. I'm so proud of her. I'm so proud of her. She's so independent. She's, she doesn't give a f*k. Like she's honestly, she hangs out with all these cute, all these boys. Yeah, no, neither does mine. Mine's in Europe right now on a thing and she doesn't know anyone. I'm like, have fun with that one. You couldn't pay me to do that. She'll have the best time. Yeah, I'm like, there's no chance you could pay me to do that. She texted me this morning. She's like, yeah, we went on an eight mile hike. I was like, you've never hiked a fucking mile.

like at home, like what? Yeah, it's good. It's good for you. It's good for you. Yeah. I'm like. All the people she's people she's all over the world. Yeah. It's incredible. I know. It's amazing. I know. But she, I don't know. I feel like she likes those kind of like adventure -ish experience. She doesn't like it for the first five days and is like, why the fuck am f*k here? Yeah, Yeah, my  didn't want to do it. My daughter, I got my daughter a job. Well, I don't say I got her the job. I helped her make an introduction for one of my friends who's a celebrity stylist. And she had the most.

the craziest week last week of just like real work, having to be like the grunt. Yeah. The schlepper. The schlepper. But she had the best week of her life with an A -list celebrity. I love that. Two like A -list celebrity situations with like, just in like a work environment, I was like, you're so like, how lucky are you that you get to be like the schlepper for some. I know. When my son gets home from summer school, he's doing like a real like internship job.

and I'm like, have fun with that. Yeah, my son's a basketball coach right now for his old coach. So, you know. That's fun. Yeah, he's, yesterday he came home. It was funny. It was his first day. Was his first day yesterday? Yeah. Yeah, it's Tuesday. So I was doing the fancy food show this week and it started on, started on.

Sarah Milken (01:12:52.461)

Sun on Saturday. I love that name, the fancy food show. It's so you. It was so fun. my God. You must have met like. It was a fucking blast. Wow. It was incredible. I mean, all these. Well, first of all, the people that like are my food friends on Instagram. Yeah. And then it's like people that like you love their product. I love that you're like so chic, but then you have this like.

quirky -ish side to you. Yeah, I get it, but the weird people are the best. My dad was like this too, like I just like - You've seen my dad on Instagram, he's like carrying the fucking dog with the bag, it's like the same thing. Yeah, it's cute. Like my dad was quirky, my dad would barbecue and he was like a cowboy and I miss him. But yeah, enjoy your dad while you have him. I know, when I see your post - You don't realize what it's like when you're like -

But yeah, I mean, but how lucky am I? And I'm so grateful that I had the opportunity to have a dad like that. A lot of people don't even have that opportunity of having a parent. So listen. My dad was like the dad, my dad still is the dad that like everyone wants. You know, like, yeah. But look what he, I mean, the gifts he gave me of being around for 85 years. I mean, that's fucking incredible. And I'm really, really lucky that I had that. And you have the belts. I have the belts. I have his knife. I have the skills. I can make his chicken wings now and all this stuff. My dad, my mom never cooked.

I think that's part of the reason I don't cook, but my dad cooked. But he never taught us anything. He just did it from himself. Like, he made this like amazing meal and we'd sit down at the table. Like my brother and I only had to set and clear the table, but we didn't have to do anything else. So it was like, I never got those skills. My daughter taught herself to cook because she was bored with us in COVID. But me, like I can't even cut an onion. Like it's like a spaz attack. It's just not your thing.

I know, but I need to... For me, I used to always say, I just don't go to therapy, I cook, because cutting an onion to me is so therapeutic, because the precision of the skill of cutting things into even pieces, I'm so... See, but I don't have that kind of fine... I do. ...motor patience. To me, that is heaven, the way that I slice the lettuce and the way that I do it. It's so interesting. It's just the knife skills for me relaxes me instantly. It's so interesting. Yeah, it's wild.

Sarah Milken (01:14:58.349)

Like I just want to buy the pre -chopped onions. You know what I mean? Like to me, I'm like, that just works. But when I watch you on Instagram, it's like so easy. It's like pouring out of you. But it's what I've done my whole life. And it's what I love to do. Like you have to love it. And it's honestly, my mom sent me to cooking class when I was in sixth grade because I was convinced she didn't want to pick me up from school. But my art teacher taught me like my life lessons. She taught me how to make brownies, like an Orange Julius. And how to like, you know, well, I went to Montessori school. I learned how to cook an egg there.

Those things kind of, you know, they they us who we are. And I really like, I enjoy it. I enjoy making my kids breakfast. Like I enjoy - I've never made my kids breakfast. That's not true. Trader Joe's has those precooked sausages, where you just take them out of the fridge, you slice them in half and then you put them on the pan. So when my husband and I always laugh when I get the text from my daughter, which is maybe once a week during the school year, she's like, can you make me a sausage? And I'm like, fuck. f*k. I'm like, no.

And the pans, I feel like the non -stick pans, they don't really work. They get brown sh*t in them. Great Jones do. Great Jones are great ones. How How do  spell that? Like, just great? Great Jones. OK. But can you do high heat? I like high heat. Because it gets it done faster. Yeah, you need to use cured cured olive oil too  you're cooking in high heat, the high philetic olive oil. I have that from you. Yeah, it's really good. The cure. What's the brand again? Cured. No, no. It was like the white bottle. You pronounce it cured. you pronounce it. And it's it's K -Y -O -R -D? Yeah, I was was cured?

for so long and she's like, it's cured. I was like, well maybe I'll use your website. I have that because of you. And read it, it's delicious. We use it on our salad dressing. But the pan still turns brown. You need to use like. I know, I'm getting your pans now. You need an SOS pad. It stresses me out. You need like a, you know, the Great Johns ones are really, really good and they last longer. There's also a really great company on Amazon that makes these black ones. They're called, I'm blanking on the name of them, but they're fantastic and they're less expensive and they're. Okay, we're gonna have to find that. Yeah, I can link it to them. Okay, because someone else told me about a stod skillet.

Staw is great. I mean, I have so much. But are those hard to clean? They're really hard to clean. Those are really hard to clean. And I have a grill pan because I'm in New York City and I don't have a barbecue in my apartment. I have a barbecue in my house. I've never turned it on. Yeah. Anyways, but I don't love cleaning those. The cast iron ones I don't love to clean. But still, it's an SOS pad and gloves. It's not a big deal. But part of the deal in my house is a lot of the times I cook and Kevin will do dishes. I know. It's like, where's the side staff? No one. Like, there's just so much.

Sarah Milken (01:17:22.445)

How do you, do you cook without a mess? I clean as I go. Got it. I clean as I go. Cause you make it looks like it's like a surgeon's office. I clean as I go. Wow. I clean as I go. It's impressive. But it's like for me, like it sort of, it chills me out. It chills me out. I'd rather scroll Instagram or pick my nose, honestly. Okay, but that's fine. That's cool. I do all that too. It's not while I'm cooking. I know. Wash my hands. Yeah, exactly. No, I just, I guess.

I have this fantasy, like emptiness fantasy, like Mr. Big and Carrie, that like my husband and I are gonna like drink wine even though we don't drink and like make this like shrimp scampi fettuccine meal. You know what I mean? And I'm like, I don't have any of those skills. Well, I do. And I doubt, I bet that once my kids are out of the house, I'll eat out a lot more. Cause it's, you know, that's my time and that's my nourishment. And that's how I show my love to my kids is cooking. That's like, you know,

I'm affectionate, but I'm not the most like crazy affectionate. I don't climb on top of them and like kiss them. My kids are always like, get off of me. My son's become a lot better with that by the way. My son's getting better at that too. That's interesting. Cause he was really bad before he went to college. He lets me do it. Totally. My daughter's like, no, my daughter's a hugger. My daughter's so sweet. I think if she has a boyfriend now, it's like I've been replaced a little bit. Maybe. Yeah. My daughter's just loving. My daughter's really loving and affectionate. My husband is too. I'm not.

But I try to be. Yeah, see, I'm not super. My husband is with me, I think, more than I am with him, I think. Yeah. He's definitely, I mean, I have to show Kevin affection. He loves affection. And when I don't, he gets a little grumpy. Mm -hmm. The sex thing, too. god. That's like a whole project unto itself. I'm like, my god. We, I think we've figured it out. OK. Very efficient. Do you schedule it? No.

Okay, neither do I. you did? I can't do that. Thursday. No, we just do it. Yeah. No, no, we don't do that anymore. No, we don't do that anymore. But we're efficient and... Yeah, you just get it. You get it done? Yeah. It's done. Is it like a project or you like enjoy it? No, it's like, you know... I have to plan it around showers and blow dries. Like who, if I want to be wet, like I have a lot of like things. These three still desire that and want to do that. Yes. That's like my thing. So it's like, you know what? Do we all, like I said, it's like you do you and...

Sarah Milken (01:19:47.725)

It works. 23 years in September, we'll be married. I mean, my husband and I have been together, married 22 together 27. Like you gotta like, and I've met him in ninth grade. Like that's all - That's That's crazy to me. Right. And so like, that's like a lot of the same person for a very long time. And we've never broken up. That's amazing. Like ever, not once, not for five minutes. That's amazing. So it's like, you really are like in it to win it. And it doesn't mean he doesn't piss me the fuck f*k

You know, of course. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm sure I'm not the easiest person to live with. I'm not. But he's not, everyone thinks he's like easy because he's not as vocal, but like he's weirdly rigid in his own ways. Like he has his routines and his jacuzzi time and his golf time and his piano lessons, like all these things. Kevin's not like that. Kevin's not like that. Kevin plays Padel with his friends. That's his one thing. He works out with Shane all the time. He's

Kevin's pretty easy, I have to say. He's very friendly. But he doesn't, it doesn't affect me, but I'm just saying he likes his personal activities. Right, I have friends, husbands that are like that, that have their scheduled things. Yeah. Kevin's just kind of not like that. And golf is only in the past year. That's a new thing. Kevin used to play golf, he stopped. interesting. He stopped. Yeah, he used to have a golf, he belonged to a golf club, all of that. Yeah, why'd he stop?

He just wasn't into it anymore. That's so interesting. Mine's just taken it up. Shane got really busy with basketball and he was a coach and he coached soccer. Okay, that's different. When you're doing travel sports. My kids didn't do that. He was like, I don't really want to do this anymore. It's not like into it. My kids didn't do travel sports. They just did basic school, straightforward. Yeah, we didn't do that. Yeah, my son did travel basketball. My daughter did travel. I'm not that mom.

I wouldn't have survived. I barely survived. And I didn't go to all those games. Like I was the mom that didn't show up to the stuff. I would show up to the important things, but like, that is over there. My son would be like, can you please not come to the volleyball tournament? It's so annoying. And like, I kind of enjoyed it a little bit, like not having to go. But then I felt like I was like the bitch mom who didn't show up, but he didn't care. I met a mom at a work thing.

Sarah Milken (01:21:56.493)

whose son was on my son's basketball team and I had never met her in the entire, and I just met her, it was like a fashion work event. She's like, our kids go to the same school, my son's a basketball player. And she's like, I've never been to one game. And I was like, you never played. And then we would switch from volleyball to baseball. I'd like show up and like all the moms knew each other. And I'm like, hi. I'm like, my son doesn't love me being at the games. And it's like, he played baseball, but it wasn't like his life. So he didn't really.

I don't care that much. My son was obsessed with basketball. Then he tore his ACL in the middle of like their championship senior year as the captain. yeah, my son had the saddest like end of his basketball career. It was so cute that his coach let him play and finish off. Cause after we knew he was having his ACL replaced, Dr. Strauss in New York, if anyone needs that, he's the most amazing doctor. I love how you, that's what's so great about you Jen, is like you support so many people. Danny Pollach though, if you have a hand.

you shout people out, you support them. You should, because people don't do that for fucking me and I wish they did. And I was like, you know what? You need to do that for other people because maybe if you put it out there, more people will listen and start doing it for others. It's so. It's fucked up. People do not support other people and people gatekeep and it's weird. And I don't, I'm a big believer in not doing that. It's impressive. Yeah, you should, you should champion people that you think are good for their job. Cause like you would look at you and be like, she's probably a bitch. Right? totally. One woman said to me the other day, she's like,

I just want you to know, if I didn't love you as much as I do, if I just met you on the street one day, I probably would think you were the biggest bitch ever. You? Yeah. No, I don't think that about you at all. And she was like, you're the most loving person, but I could see that you could be scary to someone. And I was like, fair. Maybe because you and I met in a different way. Maybe. We didn't have kids in the same... I think the kid... We just met in a different way. I don't know. I think the kid thing also throws it off because there's always this underlying...

weird competition, like even with the college sh*t, like, my God, I never showed up at school college meetings. I never went to like the school college dinners. Like, I don't wanna talk about it. Yeah, I'm the same. My husband went to all that stuff. I didn't do any of that stuff. I don't do the school event things with the other parents, because it's just not for me. My husband's really good at it, and so he does, that's like his job. Like, he does the school stuff, and I do like the food stuff, and I do.

Sarah Milken (01:24:20.205)

We have different wheelhouses. All of that stuff. Yes. Yeah, see, I do all medical. I do too. Yes, he just shows up and pays bills. I do too. You know what I mean? I take my son for his ACL. Yeah. All that stuff. Like, if there's a kid in an emergency room, Jeremy's home with the other kid. I'm in the emergency room. Yeah, yeah. Kevin will do it if he needs to sometimes. But like, when Shane split his head open, I think Kevin was at work at the time because he worked on Wall Street then. But this, you know, I was around more earlier too. So I think that's like as moms were.

were the early doctors. Well, I grew up in a house like that too. Both my parents worked, but my dad is a dentist. So he only worked three days a week, because it's a different kind of schedule, because you're like this. And so he was like Mr. Mom. He took us to school, picked us up, did all those kind of things that he worked in the nurse's office in elementary school. That's so nice. And this was like so before. That's cool. And I would say my husband.

He's very much like that. Like he's not working in the school nurse's office and he's not making brownies or the fucking potluck, but he drove morning carpool. He took our kid. Like he was a very - They're very similar, they need to meet. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. He's a very present dad, very kid first. So is Colin. Like work - I'm like what? Yeah. He's a very kid first. But here's a whole plate of food. Yeah. me, I'm like, you can order something.

I'm not even gonna bother ordering it because everything I order, everyone complains about. So I've given up on that too. I'm like, everyone has a Postmates account and a credit card, not my fucking problem. Yeah, the budget is what I need to work on. forget it. I mean, my husband thinks I'm going to... He was like, two entrees. I'm like, what? I was like, what? From like, then he's like, I'm a growing boy. Yeah, and you're like, but you shouldn't be eating here then. Two entrees, like what? No, I know. It's crazy. I'm like, what? That's, no. I know. My husband was like, do you know how much? Like, cause he does all the finances and he's like,

do you know how much you spend on your hair in a year? I'm like, no. He's like, do you wanna know? No. And I go - Who does your hair? my, I have like so many different - do you go to different people? yeah. Like, no, no, no. Like I'm asking you like I'm gonna get my hair done in a life. No, different people for different things. Like one person cuts, one person's like the blow dry, one person's the color, but I'm a committed person. Like I've been going to these people - I am too.

Sarah Milken (01:26:36.397)

Four years, I don't sleep around. I don't either, Joanna Vargas is my facialist, that's who I go to. Yeah, I go to Heather Bradley, she does my, the dermaplaning, I do it every four weeks where I get all the fucking hair, the midlife beard taken off. You should, it's life changing. And then all your products absorb into your face because you're literally shedding, have you ever done it? Like you have a pile of skin when you're done. I guess I need to try it. my God.

I think I've always been scared and weird about hair on my face because I've had hormonal issues and I was on aldactone for so long when I was younger. I've always tried to deal with the hair not growing out of my head. I take minoxidil. I used to. It made me feel fucking weird. I hated that. I stopped taking it. No. We know why you felt weird, though. Why? Because for a pharmacy, a regular pharmacy, the lowest dose is 2 .5. OK, and it's a blood pressure. It's essentially a blood pressure medication. I hated how I felt about it.

So I told one of my doctors that and she was like, I can compound it for you at half the strength. well that's why. So now, so for the first few months I took 0 .5 and I felt fine. And then I bumped it up to one milligram. So I take minoxidil every day, one milligram from a compounded pharmacy in LA. interesting. And I have these like little hairs sprouting here. I had all that too, because all my hair, as you can see here on this great angle, I'm sure. I have like all my hairline is receding. Yeah. no, mine is too. Yeah, it's fine.

It's right here, it's bad. Mine, I lose it right here. And that's like when I get really stressed, I'm like, there it goes again, it's gone again after it grew back. back. know, and I've done the PRP shit, sh*t, you have to - - just started doing that again. there's a - But But you have  be really committed to it. I just started this started this company,  it's called Great Many. I just started it and it's kind of cool. They're trying to make it like a PRP thing that's easier to -

to just go and do it. And it's a chic place. And it's like a bazillion dollars. I don't know, they were gifting it to me, but it was. Yeah. But the one I was trying to do was so much money, I was like, this is not sustainable. Like, I can't do this. That's why I kind of just. I'm trying, I was trying. I just tried the minoxidil thing. Yeah. So how often are you supposed to do that? I'm going back again, I think it's like six weeks. So I'm going back again in six weeks. Do they have an LA? I think they're going to open up a lot of it. It's this chic, amazing company. It's these two guys that started, gosh, I'm sorry, guys. What'd you say it was called again? It's called Great Money.

Sarah Milken (01:28:53.837)

Yeah, it's the one here in Soho, right, just above Houston Street. It's over by Raffs, that amazing restaurant, which you should go to while you're in town. But it's chic and it was sort of like normalizing PRP. my husband, we have like this whole long story about his fucking hair. Yeah, everyone's bald, fine, in this family. Everyone's bald in my family. Like, it's a whole thing. But he started taking Propecia at 19, and I've been with him since we were 19.

I've watched the progression of the hair and I looked at him a year ago and I was like, what's going on with your hair? Like it's really thin. Like what? Like you've lost a lot of hair this year. And I wasn't trying to be a bitch, but I was like, I'm trying to keep my sh*t together. Like you're on Propecia. Like what's happening? He goes, I haven't taken it for two years. there you go. I was like, wait, but that's not optional.

Like, unless you have a problem and you don't have erectile dysfunction clearly, so why, what's the issue? He was like, I don't know, I just got lazy. I'm like, no, no. So I took him to this hair doctor in LA and I was like, what's happening? He's like, well, you can do hair transplants. And my husband, who barely will take a Tylenol, is like, get the f*k out of here. Like, what are you talking about? So many guys are doing that here. It's like a thing here in New York. I know, it's a thing in LA too. It's a full thing. But my husband, like, I can barely get him to take Tylenol.

So I was like, okay. That's like a one shot thing. You just have like the surgery and like. Yeah, but it's a pretty intense recovery. Yeah, I know. And he's a baby, like literally a moron when it comes to like healing. He's not gonna do well. Not well. And so the guy was like, okay, I'm gonna give you deutesteride, but it's stronger than Propecia. So if you get like sexual dysfunction stuff, like, so he came up with like a dosing where he like micro doses it. Like I don't even know. Is it working?

Is that fair? Jen, we went to our high school reunion last year, because we were in the same grade, and this guy says to me, did your husband have a hair transplant? No way, that's amazing. I swear to God. The microdosing of the deutasteride, and he uses some like clinical strength, minoxidil that the doctor gave him that comes once a month to the house. I'm telling you. I need to get all this information from you because I need this for someone. He grew his hair back, and my son, who probably, like, he doesn't give a sh*t. He's 19.

Sarah Milken (01:31:16.557)

And he was like, mom, I took Accutane and I feel like my hair is thinning. My son did. Yeah, right? It's a real thing. I know. I feel like I need to do something for my son. I'm all over it. OK. You need to send send everything. Yeah, he doesn't take the deutestoride or the Propecia, because I feel like that can kind of like fuck f*k your sex drive a little bit. And the deutestoride, if you don't like it, it stays in your system for a little bit, like a couple of months. That Accutane hair loss thing is real. It's real.

Yeah. And so he, but he's done some of these exosome injection things and he's done, he does the same topical stuff as my husband. And he also does the topical deutestoride. But my husband doesn't do that because he takes the pill. Okay. So I don't know. It's all these little, you know, like we all have our dumb little hacks and tricks and things that we're trying to do to keep our sh*t together.

My son's mad at me that I didn't put him on growth hormones. And I'm like, at the time you weren't short and you're still not short, you're five foot, he's like five foot eight and a half. I'm like, dude, you're fine. He's fine. He's fine. He's fine. He's fine. He's fine. He's trying to. He's like mad. And I'm like, I'm sorry. I'm not perfect. Like if I knew, like if you were a basketball player, we would have had a different conversation. But like, you're just the typical Jew. Like welcome to the world, you know?

And like your dad's, my husband says he's 5 '10". There's no fucking chance he's 5 '10". My husband's 5 '10". Right, I mean, he said maybe 5 '9". I don't know. Maybe he's shrinking. Let's talk about the shrinking. I'm shrinking. But do you know you're shrinking? Like, did you measure yourself? No, to be honest, I think I've just always been kind of shorter. I just wear really high heels. Now I'm kind of into wearing flats because I work in the Empire State Building. So do you think you're shorter or are you really shorter?

I think I'm shrinking for sure. I had bone density tests done and - I did a dexa scan. Yeah, and I have some issues. So I definitely, I definitely am shrinking. I know I was five eight. That's tall. I know I was five eight. And what are you now? I'm like five, six and a half. Okay. I'm definitely shrinking. Okay, so you're - It's real. It's real. I'm definitely, it's real. It's real. It's real. It's real. I actually, I have to measure myself, but -

Sarah Milken (01:33:35.336)

Like I said, my daughter's over five, six, and in photos, I'm looking particularly small. I know, I just look really small next to all of my kids. And all these people who see me on Instagram and then see me in person, they're like, you're really small. I didn't realize you were that short. And everyone's like, you're like a - These people don't tell you that you look younger in person. People are like, you look so much younger in person. I was like, thanks. How can I get this, like, the small thing a lot? And I'm like, okay, like I'm five, two and a half, like.

I'm not dealing with, like, I don't have any options on that. It's like, I don't know. You don't seem super tiny to me. I don't know. It's just funny. I'm like, I'm gonna have like a complex about that or something. Okay, let's talk about makeup. What do you wanna know? I mean, honestly, like you're on Instagram, you're like showing 40 ,000 things. Like today, what's your, I mean, I know you have so many products like I do on the product tour. Dr. McQueen makes the, Dr. McQueen, in my opinion, makes the best tinted like,

How do you spell that? Macreen, -A -C -R -E -N -E. She's an amazing cosmetic derm who I love here in New York. I don't see her professionally for any injectables or anything, but I know her and we're friendly. And she has an amazing, she's got great skincare products. Her eye cream is really, really good. But I also, I actually met her at her event when she launched her eye cream, but she has an amazing tinted moisturizer serum. It's incredible. It's a little bit thicker than most. Some people think it's too thick. I love it.

I need a darker color. I wear that every day. I don't wear makeup. Do you wear anything under it? I know, I'll use. You know what I love? G Beauty makes a really good primer. I love her. I love them. She's the fucking best. I love her. They're the fucking best. I just love her. I know. She's amazing. I know. I'm actually, I'm going to Miami after this and I'm trying to interview her there, but I need to find a podcast studio in Miami. They're the best. I've known her a really long time. I love her so much. She's so cute. She taught me how to do my makeup, like coming out of COVID. She sent me like a full video. Her bronzer. you said I looked tan. I use her bronzer. I love her bronzer.

the Golden Glow one. And she has a primer. She has a cool product. Their primer's really good and their bronzer. Those are the two favorite G Beauty products they make. I love Merit. I do too. I love Merit. Their blush, Beverly Hills is the best color in the world. I love their stuff. But when you put that blush on that's like a little stick thing, yeah. The little circle? Does it move your tinted moisturizer? No, because I don't put that much tinted moisturizer on. I'm really like, I get itchy scratchy if I feel like I have a mask on of makeup so I don't wear a lot.

Sarah Milken (01:35:53.192)

If I go out at night, I use Armani foundation. It's the best, it's light. They make a very - Which one? I don't know. I have two colors, the light one, whatever. I don't know. No, I could tell you the name later. Okay. They make a very good concealer too. I also like the Dior Backstage Concealer is really good. I have -

eyelash extensions and I have microbladed brows. I haven't done the extensions on my eye. I'm afraid that my real eyelashes are just gonna fall out forever. I mean, listen, I was gluing on individuals. I saw that. You were amazing at it. I'm really fucking good at it. It was my skill. It's like a skill. I don't, yeah, it's, I, but now I've been putting extensions on because I've been so busy that I don't have time to even take that extra 15 minutes to do it. But did you lose your original eyelashes? Not yet. I mean, probably.

I don't have a lot of hair anyway. I know. I don't even like shave my, I literally shave my like once a month. I lasered my, I lasered a long time ago. But I have such light hair. It's ridiculous. Yeah, me too. Me too. My skin's starting to go. knockout beauty, Kylie Kabaco. I just interviewed her again. I love her. I love her so much. She put me on, all my skincare is from her. She's the most incredible. She will put you on a resume. I'm like, now you guys all need to talk to her and go to her. And she will, it's like not.

pushing like super crazy expensive products, just products that work and like. They're just, they're long haul products. They're workers. She knows what's up. She's so funny. I have melasma issues like she does. So we just interviewed last week in person and like, we're like, I just said to her, we gotta like do a deep dive. She's amazing. She's the best. So she's changed my skin on my face, just in terms of skin texture. But also I started this body stuff, this Environ, the Dermalax she put me on and the body oil. I use a cream that has Retin -A in it, but I don't use that one.

I like that a lot. What else do I like? I like Agent Attour, their deodorant, I love. But do you put lotion on before you leave the house? If I put lotion on, like I took a quick shower this morning, if I put lotion on and walked outside, I would be in a pool of sweat. My body, it feels like pantyhose on my body. I can't take it. Do you like the smell of coconut?

Sarah Milken (01:37:51.816)

I love it. There's a really light lotion that you buy at Whole Foods. It's called Skin Trip. It's fucking amazing. I've worn it since high school. It's the lightest body lotion you can put on, and it smells like coconut, and you smell amazing all day, and people will stop you on the street. But you don't get hot? No, you don't get hot from it. It's not like putting on like a shrink wrap rubber. Right, I can't. I'd be sweating out my... Yeah, no, it's amazing. Whole Foods, it's like $11 .99. How do you spell it? Skin Trip. It's incredible. They make a body bar too. It's incredible. It's natural. What other skincare things? I like Merit. I like Sape. You loofah?

Not really. Do you dry brush? Yeah, I dry brush. I like the, which is the dry brush that I like. Who is it? I can't remember right now. Do you Gua Sha? Yeah, I Gua Sha. Every day? Sometimes, I remember. Sometimes. Okay. I don't know, I do red light. See, I have one of those amazing red light things from Jason Diamond, but I'm scared to use it because they say that red light with melasma can sometimes be questionable. Ask Kylie. I know. Ask Kylie. I like Say Beauty a lot.

I do too. I love Say Beauty. What else do I like? my lips. I like, I do like the Charlotte Tilbury iconic nude. I have that on today. I like that a lot. I lost mine. I need to get another one. I have like Buxom on today or something. And then I like Lawless, Forget the Filler in what's the Rosie Outlook is the color that I wear all the time. I have a lot of red in my lips. I love it. That's a natural one too. Cause if you're gloss, I like to make sure it's clean too. Because if you're eating it all day, try it. Yeah. I eat it like crazy. Sorry, my hair's falling down.

Hair color's Jenna Perry. I go to Jenna herself or I go to Jules, who's amazing there, Jessica Gillen for haircuts. Do you just do one color? I do one color. Sometimes I'll highlight it like every so often, but. Yeah, see I do, since I've gone darker, I do like one highlight a year and then like sometimes I don't, I don't have gray hair, which is really weird. I know. I'm so lucky. I know, it's.

It doesn't make sense. My mom doesn't have gray hair. It just doesn't make sense. You're so lucky. I know. My husband has gray hair though. I don't have time to have gray hair. I know. But I don't have it. Literally, I was like, there this morning, I was like, because I'm going with you, I'm like, I don't have time to have gray hair. But isn't it, I don't know why I don't have it. I mean, my mom didn't have it. But I don't, like, sometimes I don't color my hair for six months. And then I feel like my colorist is going to think I left her. Jamie Levin. She's amazing. Like, everyone always asks me about my hair color. All the time. And I'm like,

Sarah Milken (01:40:13.544)

I go to this one girl, just this one girl. Your hair's a lot longer than it used to be. It is longer. It's longer, I like it longer. I feel like, you know how they always say for you to have shorter hair as you get older? I'm like, as long as I'm not a stripper, then I'm okay. I'll clip in those hair extensions all day long. I can clip them in. Yeah, as long as I don't look like a full stripper, I'm fine.

I never have been blessed in the hair market. So I've always been done. But like the best hair extensions in New York is Jessica Gillen. Everyone knows that. She's the Jenna Perry. She's the queen. And are they in all the time or they're clipping? The mine are clipping. I don't do the bonded ones any longer because for the few strands of hair that I do have, it like pulls them out. really? But Jess cuts my hair. She's the best. She's the cool girl haircut. She's on my dog. Everyone goes to her. I have a hairstylist. He cuts my hair and blow dries my hair. Well, I have two people. I have one woman who does blow dries.

Catherine Webb, Bi Webb, in Santa Monica. And then I have this guy, Carlos Castellanos, and he is at Royal. If I could pack him in my suitcase and bring him, like on this trip, I said to him, I'm like, what the f*k? Like, if I wash my hair, I'm gonna look like a drowned rat. Because he has to like, I have such, I have so little amount of hair.

that he does this whole teasing thing, spray, like he has to create the texture. I refuse to pay for a blowout. I think it's the biggest waste of money. I will not ever, this morning the people look at me in the hair salon like, what the f*k are you doing? I'm like, I'm blowing up my own hair. I know not so much. No, no, no. Cause my hair is down for one day, then it's back. It's just, it's not, I just don't. Yeah, but if I get a blow dry, I don't have to wash my hair for four or five days. That's amazing. You know, so for me it's worth every penny. And according to my husband, I'm like over the top. So whatever.

But if we added up all his golf and his car, I could give a rat's ass about my car. He cares about that. So not my problem. It's a thing. It's a thing. Yeah, exactly. And golf. And like golf. I'm like, there's all these weird putters coming to my house and grips. And now he's into the golf outfits. Does he wear his weighted vest under his golf outfit? He hasn't been able to wear the weighted vest because he's having back issues. I know. I asked him if he was in mani -pos. he might be. Yeah.

Sarah Milken (01:42:33.896)

We're gonna find out what the blood work. They're all starting to get a little crotchety. I said to him, I'm like, maybe you should have your testosterone checked. Well, Kevin was like, that's nice. And I'm like, well, if I have to test my estrogen, you might need to, his testosterone was fine the last round, but I was like, I don't know, maybe you're complaining that you're more tired lately. You never know. I have to go. I know. All right, we're gonna wrap up because Jen has to go. I have to go, I have a five o 'clock downtown. I love you though.

I know. Wait, let me look at my list and see if there's any questions that I missed and I don't have my glasses on. I didn't even know you had questions prepared. Look at you. Well, just I just wanted to make sure that, OK, couple of things. Just one thing. OK, I have to go. Yeah. It's four. What's your bucket list? What's on your bucket list? Is there anything you like want to do? I want to go to Morocco. That's cool. So do I. I want to go to Morocco. OK. I want to go to Morocco. I love that. I want to travel more.

I wanna see the world more. I don't wanna - I feel like you travel a lot for work. I do, but I wanna be able to travel the world to see more of the world and not continue to go to the same places. I don't understand why people like to go to the same place. I don't like to go to the same place either. I don't understand that. And do you like to just travel with your husband or are you like a friends traveler? I'm both. I'm both. But is it couples or just with your husband? I do all of it. I just like to travel. I love traveling. Traveling's fun with people. You don't mind the plane flight? I hate flying. No. No.

How do you keep yourself busy? On plane? Netflix, because I never get to watch TV. I know, I don't watch TV either. What are you watching right now? Bridgerton, I just finished it last night. I never watched it. I fucking love it. Should I try that again? I love it so much. I watched one and I was like, eh. I love it. I mean, I've like Yellowstone, all that sh*t, like all that stuff. I watch all those things because I don't ever get to do that. I don't have time to do it. I love Yellowstone. OK, one piece of advice for midlife women who are just feeling like stuck or they want the next thing or just not feeling like

comfortable in their skin. I think we all feel that way. I think it's normal to, I think understanding that everyone else is feeling the same way as you is really important to know that you're not alone. I had to say to my friend this morning, I was like, you know what, she said something she was upset about and I said, you're not alone. And just realize that your feelings are valid and it's okay to not feel perfect all the time. That's normal. And do you find that your friends understand some more of the nuance than your husband does?

Sarah Milken (01:44:57.192)

No, my husband gets it. Mine does too, but I find that a lot of people, like my husband asks the details, like he could go onto a plane and then come off the plane and tell you every single thing that every single person was wearing. Like he's observant. my God. He's like observant as f**k and gets it. But sometimes I need like the girl voice to be like, I totally know what you're feeling. I have my period too. I feel like sh*t. I don't think they a hundred percent get the hormone thing.

that it's real, that you're not being a fucking bitch on purpose. No, I think my husband gets that. Kevin's an understanding guy. Kevin's - Well, Well, has to be married to you. Yeah. Don't you think? Yeah, I'm not easy. Yeah,  easy. Yeah, I'm Yeah, like I don't  the easiest person in the world. But I'm so happy you're here. I know, thanks for having me. I'm I'm so happy you sweat with  I know, and now we're cool and ready to go. Now Cool cruel. Now I have to run  know. Because I'm late. Because I - Yeah, Yeah, I know. Because I love talking to you. I I know, it was so fun. Thank you for having  fun. Love you. Love Love you. Okay. Love you. I have to go. I'm so 

Sarah Milken (01:45:57.512)

You're so tall. I'm not tall. I'm wearing big shoes. I'm short. Thanks you guys.

Sarah Milken (01:46:19.987)

We need to talk about exercise. We need to do another one. Nice to meet you.